So bush has signed a $25B
So bush has signed a $25B "Loan" to the auto industry, to help them convert to building more energy efficient vehicles. Uhhh- what have they been doing for the last 40 years since the last energy crisis?
I'd be willing to wage this loan will never be repaid...
You are right.Hydrogen fuel
You are right.Hydrogen fuel cells are the only hope we have for the near future.I think more research has to be done to improve its efficiency.
I'd love to believe you
I'd love to believe you but you've got to give us some reason to believe that what you've got works. I don't understand how it improves anything so you need to give us something substantial.
Can't you get a neutral lab to certify you. Perhaps if you don't have enough cash to pay a lab, you could start with just some local community college with an auto repair professor that might verify gas mileage improvement.
I could also point you to other neutral labs that might certify your stuff as well if you like.
Hi ex-EV1 driver - we are
Hi ex-EV1 driver - we are actually going to be doing that soon. Right now our main focus has been R&D to refine and produce the most efficient generators with a small enough footprint to fit any car.
Currently our testing has been confined to actual road tests and mileage checks, as well as bench top production model measurements using hhometers and lab quality air/gas flow meters.
Nothing really matters to me unless it's practical. The bottom line is- will it work and can it save people money. I've seen various iterations with guys touting enormous LPM (liters per minute), but the generators are so huge they have to strap it to their bumper or put it in their trunk. Others are dismal under performers (like the glass mason jars you see around) and are useless for long term.
Once we have our final testing done and have finished modifying our commercial grade model, then we will do a full lab test by an independent company, and various smog/emissions testing as well. I'll keep you posted on that...
Our goal is to shrink it down to the smallest most efficient model available, and we're very close. We have investors wanting to sponsor us and have some pretty big news coming up, which I cannot talk about yet.
Regarding how it works... it's not some "free energy" model like many are shouting, not by a long shot. But given that the IC engine is only about 20% or less efficient (actually watched a report the other day that only 6% of the energy in gas actual makes it to the wheels) it doesn't take much to increase mileage.
Hydrogen burns at 40,000 FPS, gasoline only 4,000 FPS (feet per second). SO when you inject a small amount of hydrogen and oxygen into the air/fuel mix, the hydrogen burns fast and with an incredible force. That results in less gas needed.
The lower heat results because hydrogen burns so fast that heat has less time to transfer to the cylinder walls. I've seen as much as 10 degree drop, but more usually about 5.
It burns so much extra particulate and unburned fuel that you can put a white rag on the exhaust and do a before and after test. Before- black ring, after - clean rag, no ring. We'll be filming one of these tests soon as well.
There's a whole lot more that can be said, but I'll save that for another post.
I appreciate the skepticism - I was one myself until I saw it actually work.
No problem, glad to discuss
No problem, glad to discuss it.
regarding sales page- you went to wrong page for kits. The "high powered" sales pitch is our book that was originally written to help people understand, build and install these in their car using readily available parts. The vast majority of the sales fee is to cover commissions to the affiliates who do a great job of getting it out there. The profits help to pay for further research and testing, refining of product.
Kits are at hhokitsdirect.com (can't put links anymore ala request from hc.com) and are aimed at those that understand the technology and just want to install. The site will be refined as time permits, but right now, we're too busy building and selling with requests coming from around the world. I even have a high end custom auto manufacturer wanting to develop a product line specifically for their 100K+ cars.
So, we are not approaching this as some flash in the pants journey. Results will top theory anytime.
I'm well aware of the hydrogen bond and efficiencies. I'm also keenly aware of the inefficiencies of current IC motors. By itself, HHO gas will not run an IC engine smoothly without a huge production rate (about 10 LPM for a small 5 horsepower 4 stroke) which takes about 4000 watts of input. Certainly not self-running, but highly efficient.
However, when mixed with gas or diesel in the air/fuel mix, it is extremely efficient, a very small amount can make the gas burn much cleaner, more thoroughly than current combustion cycles without it.
I'm glad to discuss this and continue the conversation - I don't mind skepticism, name calling/sanity checks are not necessary. Let's reason together.
I agree that independent testing is most definitely where the industry will gain credibility, which is why I said we are planning to do just that. We are developing an aggressive business plan and have investors ready to put hard cash into this venture. Our goal is to legitimize a fledgling industry that has incredible potential. Just because there are some who are wackos out there does not discount that the technology has incredible possibilities.
Regarding HHOmeter, it's a new term to describe a measurement device designed to measure density and Liters Per Minute production rates of HHO generators. It's low tech and inexpensive to make, reminiscent of the early days of magnetism and electricity, where devices needed to be made to give an indication of power, resistance, etc.
"If it is a real, commercially produced instrument, please tell me where I can get one. If it is a homebrewed machine, I'd like to hear how it works." Why? are you going to try and actually build one of these? :)
That's all for now,
You're throwing things
You're throwing things out that I never saw in chemistry class so I'm deferring to higher authorities before declaring it to be meaningless technobabble that you or someone else made up. If you have a minute, you might go back and try to help me understand what this HHO stuff you refer to really is from a traditional physical chemistry perspective. Is it a molecule of some kind?
I'll try to get back to you in a few days, after I've consulted with others who are smarter than me. I'm lucky to be able to hang out with some of the smartest people in the world so I'll see if I can pursuade some of them to help me debunk your scheme. Most of them won't give you the time of day but they may help me out.
Regarding my brusk nature, I only agreed to deal with your statements, even though I believe them to be unfounded. I will try to avoid any name calling but I do reserve the right to call things as I see them. I will try to avoid superflous name calling but "ignorant", "scam", and "fraud" are not just names if they are true, whether or not someone likes them.
I grow tired of people selling perpetual motion machines (like bumper propellers with generators to charge the batteries in an EV) , unobtanium reactors, conveniently missed details, the Brooklyn Bridge, and other fantasy schemes shaming and scaring well intentioned investors when we really need that capital to find solutions to our planet's very real energy problems.
"Most of them won't give you
"Most of them won't give you the time of day but they may help me out."
Are you really this pompous? You have no idea who will and who won't give me the time of day. I constantly consult with others who are brilliant in their fields and am working with some now to take our company to the next phase. We have companies and investors who see the viability of our products.
While you spend your time trying to debunk what I do, I'm experimenting, building and testing better and more efficient models, installing them in vehicles, and getting referrals because of positive results.
I have no more time to deal with you and your arrogance if this is your only goal. I will use my time to actually work on developing things that will help our world- what are you doing except spending your time cutting down others that don't fit your pre-concieved notions?
I thought I could get an intelligent conversation going- something that appears to be impossible with you.
I have no problem
I have no problem answering any questions regarding this technology as long as people are willing to have an open minded, intelligent discussion.
To answer your questions, We offer a one year warranty on current models and guarantee mileage increase or you can take the kit out and send it back for a refund.
The Hydrogen Generator Kits are quite durable made with high quality 316L stainless steel plates and will last for many years - can be transferred from one car to the next. The only maintenance required is to flush and re-fill with fresh distilled water and electrolyte about every three months (just like an oil change), this keeps the thing running at maximum efficiency.
If you have any other questions, feel free to ask.
Transitional Technologies, LLC
Great Idea! I've contacted
Great Idea! I've contacted both of them to inquire about exhibitor prices. We are factoring 2-4 exhibits a year into our business plan. Thanks for the heads up. I'll let you know if we are able to attend - love to show you what we have in person, with a vehicle on hand.
I love the idea of the MPG contest at hybridfest. I asked them what the requirements are there as well, since the best demo is real life competition.
Transitional Technologies, LLC
While I came down
While I came down pretty hard on hybridman2, I've continued to dig further into what the introduction of hydrogen into an ICE cylinder would do.
Unfortunately, I can't find anything quantitative or substantive, but, there is some evidence that hydrogen may help, as hybridman2 says with the gasoline-air combustion. Likewise, a little water in the cylinder may help too but it can destroy the cylinders.
Making up silly names like HHO or "Brown's gas", doesn't help anything.
My suggestion for Transitional Technologies is to cut the HHO/Brown's gas nomenclature and get with traditional science. Also, I suggest you cut the attempts to generate Hydrogen (H2) onboard and carry a small tank of H2. Then compare the fuel efficiency gain of simply injecting the H2 into your engine and not injecting it. You can also determine the quantitative benefit of how much H2 should be injected. This should determine the value of the H2, then, the only issue will be: what is the best way to get your H2. I'll bet that some cheesy onboard generator is not the best way but I'll look forward to your witnessed results.
Actually, introducing pure
Actually, introducing pure hydrogen into a normal ICE engine is not good, at least in quantities that would matter. It has to be compressed to be stored- when it it released into the engine it expands and is extremely cold- this can cause embrittlement to the interior of the engine.
Just so you know Ex-EV1, I didn't invent the name HHO. If you want to do some research- look into Yull Brown who is the researcher that discovered its unique properties in the late 60's. Until recently it was more commonly called "Brown's Gas". He also was the one who discovered what traditional science would not - it's OK to allow the remixing of H and O after separating them into their constituent gases.
Cheesy generators- nice. We wouldn't have even been distributing yet if it were not for the demand for our products. If you think we are resting there you are as mistaken as your assumptions.
We are currently designing commercial grade models that will blow away the handmade units being sold around the world. We are in negotiations with an auto manufacturer about designing an OEM unit for their vehicles (unfortunately not one of the Big 3). We are developing a vehicle system for the coming Xprize competition.
What are doing except griping and moaning that it can't be done. Thank God you weren't around when the wright brothers were working on their plane - of course there were plenty of engineers like you back then that were shouting loudly it wouldn't fly. Do you realize how closely your own accusations sounds to back then?
IS this niche perfected? Not by a long shot. Are there still breakthroughs that need to happen? You bet. Same thing in every alternative technology available today. We need better batteries, better motors, more efficient ICE's and combustion processes. That's our goal. That's what we are striving for.
Or we could just bury our head in the sand and shout expletives at anyone that tries something new.
Why don't you focus your anger on someone else for awhile- like the BIg 3 that can't keep up with technology breakthroughs and yet have their hand out again for more money...
Transitional Technologies, LLC
Hybrid Water Power is a transitional technology
if all this is true why does
if all this is true why does shell hydrogen enriched fuel inprove my fuel economy