Comments on: Opel Says it Will Lead EV Race, Working on More Vehicles

By: KAA

KAA — Mon, 14 Nov 2011 13:55:52 +0000

Actually all combustion produces water. The largest pollutant emitted from a gas car is water. Another example is high efficiency gas furnaces. My high efficiency gas furnace produces many times more water the my air conditioner. I expect a hydrogen ICE engine will produce about the same amount of water as a gas engine. While a fuel cell vehicle will produce significantly less. There are my other reasons why I think fuel cell vehicles won’t work. Principally the cost. All indications are that hydrogen won’t be cheap. I expect fueling a hydrogen vehicle will be 2X the cost of gas, while electric refueling will be cheaper.

By: Capt. Concernicus

Capt. Concernicus — Wed, 02 Nov 2011 13:03:17 +0000

@ Shines,

I agree with you on the looks. Way better than the Smart car.

However at a price point of $20k for a vehicle between a motorcycle and a car with no heat, A/C, rough ride and nosier? Almost sounds like you're describing the Ariel Atom. lol!

I would tend to think that this would only capture a small market segment. Maybe a 1-2k units sold a year.

I agree that we need to think outside the box, but it also needs to be a mainstream vehicle.

By: Shines

Shines — Wed, 02 Nov 2011 00:20:18 +0000

Capt. Concernicus I can see how you would view it that way. This is a concept vehicle and I think people need to think outside the box a bit more. I see this as a new type of motorcycle not a car in the traditional sense. This could be made available with a luggage compartment – the concept doesn’t but there seems to be plenty of room (physically and design wise) to add some storage. It should be lighter than the Smart, much more efficient, would probably have better performance, and it looks much cooler than the Smart. As a motorcycle it wouldn’t have AC or heating and would be noisier and have a much rougher ride. Still if it was electric, was fast enough for the freeway, and costs way under $20k I think there would be a certain market for it. I’m just sayin’…

By: Capt. Concernicus

Capt. Concernicus — Tue, 01 Nov 2011 22:24:00 +0000

@Shines,

I see enough to know that this vehicle will sell less than the Smartfortwo car especially in the U.S. Plus, if you have two people where do you put groceries, luggage, golf clubs or anything else? So I still believe this is a waste of time, resources and effort. So households with two or more people will need a second vehicle since this won't do the trick.

By: Shines

Shines — Tue, 01 Nov 2011 17:21:54 +0000

Capt. Concernicus – The RAK-e is a 2 seater – just tandem – like a motorcycle the passenger sits behind the driver. Talk about a waste of resources. How often is more than 2 people riding in a 4 or 5 passenger car?

By: dhc

dhc — Tue, 01 Nov 2011 15:12:02 +0000

Hydrogen? What’s wrong with water as an emission? Well, let’s see… more water into the atmosphere means more greenhouse effect (water vapor is a greenhouse gas). Also, more importantly, you WILL change climates. All this extra water in the air… How do you think it comes out of the air… as rain or snow. So say hi to totally new weather patterns that fluxuate with energy use. Oh.. but where does the hydrogen come from.. unless we are harvesting it from the sun, we have to get it from the electrolysis of water (using energy to separate H2O to H2 and O). As no process is 100% efficient there will be a net energy loss. More importantly, where does all the water come from? There is a shortage of clean water in this world, not a surplus. It’s like feeding our cars food. We’d be sacrificing something people need to survive to our cars.

By: Capt. Concernicus

Capt. Concernicus — Tue, 01 Nov 2011 12:09:23 +0000

@ James-

Nuclear powered cars? Yeah, right. Maybe in the future when it's safe. But maybe you're also envisioning no accidents on the roads also? Can anyone else imagine driving around a vehicle that has nuclear energy stored in it on the roads where 30,000+ people die in car accidents every year in the U.S. alone? Oh hazmat crews would certainly have their hands full wouldn't they. You can't just wash nuclear radiation off the roads.

Hydrogen? As one other poster stated it's a losing proposition at this point in time.

As far as the RAK-e vehicle. I think that's a waste of resources. It looks like it seats only one person. How efficient is that? It's not. Not even if you're a single person because owning that means you'll be taking your date around on a bus, taxi or train. That's really romantic. lol!

By: Shines

Shines — Mon, 31 Oct 2011 22:13:54 +0000

James Davis – I did what you said – I did a search on “hydrogen fuel cell battery on wheels”. The first article I read stated: Using water for fuel is like burning a fire with the left over ashes. Think abut it, when stopped at a light look at what’s dripping out of the tail pipe of the ice car in front of you. That is water… The only way to get the energy the hydrogen carries back out of the water is by putting energy into it. If you have an overabundance of extra energy – such as Norway’s Geothermal or a desert’s solar or wind power you could use it to recollect the hydrogen from water, but you might as well use the energy more directly.
Anyway – back to the article – I like the idea of a 4 wheel motorcycle with an enclosed compartment to protect the driver. It doesn’t have to have a padded dash, glove box, carpeting, and other amenities of a car. Skip the door paneling and sound insulation and save the weight. It would make a fine commuter vehicle.

By: MrEnergyCzar

MrEnergyCzar — Mon, 31 Oct 2011 17:17:38 +0000

Hydrogen isn't an energy source. It's a net energy loser so they'll never be widespread. It's always more efficient to put the electricity directly into a battery than use it to make hydrogen, store and compress it, then burn it etc....

MrEnergyCzar

By: Max Reid

Max Reid — Sun, 30 Oct 2011 23:27:29 +0000

Make a car that has 4 wheels and seats atleast 4 passengers and price it affordable for masses.

Don't build those funky vehicles with 3 wheels or that can take 2 passengers. A car should be a family vehicle.

Spark EV looks good. When Tesla comes out with Model S and if it has a 300 mile range, then the interest in Fuel Cell may slow down.

But still fuel cells can be used to generate heat & electricity using natgas which contains 80% Hydrogen.

Also heavy vehicles can use fuel cells since battery may not be powerful enough to run them.