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  1. #1
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    E85 or Hybrid-to reduce oil dependency

    With all of the debate over diesel or hybrid, another question came to mind...

    E85 or Hybrid?

    Both can reduce oil dependency (and screw OPEC) when used in large numbers, and both have their merits and disadvantages. I just wanted to see what opinions you guys might have.

    Quite personally, if Ford made the FFV Escape Hybrid available, I'd buy it in a heartbeat, but until then, I am driving around in my Civic Hybrid.

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  3. #2
    Guest

    E85 or Hybrid-to reduce oil dependency

    Why not E85 *AND* hybrid?

  4. #3
    Guest

    E85 or Hybrid-to reduce oil dependency

    Screwing OPEC is just another stupid moving target.

    Just let the market work. The most reliable suppliers get the highest premium and the most efficient forms of energy the most currency.

    Both good for my part of the world. And when those unreliable suppliers throw a little on the market .... they get discounted.

  5. #4
    Guest

    E85 or Hybrid-to reduce oil dependency

    But len, we are the market. Note that I haven't suggested any government intervention into the market. This is simply a forum for common people to discus the options, their experiences, ideas, preferences, etc.

  6. #5
    Guest

    E85 or Hybrid-to reduce oil dependency

    EV1 makes a good point that I really haven't seen discussed. Why not combine Hybrid technology with something else more fuel efficient? Why not Hybrid Diesel, or Hybrid E85 until we can get full EV. We'll still need something to burn to produce the electricity even then, so where do we turn? Obviously solar/hydro/wind (SHW) seem to be the best answers, but what other sensible options are there. I tend to hesitate when we turn to coal/nat. gas/nuclear because of the more apparent problems.

    Sometimes I think that big business shies away from SHW because it's not a limited commodity.

  7. #6
    Guest

    E85 or Hybrid-to reduce oil dependency

    instead of e85. why not use biodiesel? diesel cars can run on biodiesel now. biodiesel can also be 100 bio instead of 85%. diesel cars are also less to manufacture than hybrid cars.

  8. #7
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    Seriously, though, if you live in a colder climate, diesel is a pain. Hybrid gas is a much cleaner and more efficient technology than e85 until we can get better battery tech. I have an Insight, and when I began looking on the web for fuel tips, I see that people have doubled both the Insight and Prius gas mileage by simply adding more battery packs (going from 75MPG to over 150MPG).

  9. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by pkellmey View Post
    Seriously, though, if you live in a colder climate, diesel is a pain.
    As I said in reply to a similar post - not true. Older diesels perhaps, but the newer diesel cars don't have a problem starting in cold climates anymore than a gasoline-based car.

  10. #9
    my understanding is that it takes a lot less processing to make bio-diesel rather than ethanol from organic sources than to make ethanol. Also, there may be a lot more bio-diesel producing plants than ethanol ones. This would make a diesel engine able to use more types of plants, some of which may be less impactful to grow in different locations. Overall, I see the diesel-hybrid as offering more flexibility and efficiency than an ethanol-hybrid.
    Of course, the hybrid drivetrain is critical for both to improve overall efficiency in an automobile

  11. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by ex-EV1 driver View Post
    my understanding is that it takes a lot less processing to make bio-diesel rather than ethanol from organic sources than to make ethanol.
    True, but there's a lot more money behind ethanol.

    Also, there may be a lot more bio-diesel producing plants than ethanol ones.
    Don't know about that.

    This would make a diesel engine able to use more types of plants, some of which may be less impactful to grow in different locations. Overall, I see the diesel-hybrid as offering more flexibility and efficiency than an ethanol-hybrid.
    Definitely true. Given the hit in fuel economy and the barely positive (at best) energy return on energy invested with corn ethanol, you have to wonder what the point of E85 is. Unless, of course, you're ADM or Cargill.

    Of course, the hybrid drivetrain is critical for both to improve overall efficiency in an automobile
    They say the added expense is uneconomic, no one would buy them. They said the same thing about hybrids in general. Where are Honda and Toyota now, and where are the Big 3? Ignoring short term fluctuations, gas is only going to get more expensive, so there's a demand right there. Build'em, I say -- we'll buy them.

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