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  1. #211

    Hybrid or Diesel?

    Thanks for the link on the Mercedes. I am glad to see emissions getting a tough treatment ( in a good way) in a diesel car. I think 35 MPG is pretty good too, although certainly its not 45 or 50 or however one wants to define the type of mileage the hybrid lot tends to get.

    The original poster was asking about stuff available today, so although I have a major interest in future technology, the discussion got off into pie in the sky stuff the US passenger market hasnt seen and may never see; since we have this cool Fuel efficiency and emisions calculator on this website, we can plug in the best diesel offerings of today and look at the emissions profile and compare to hybrids and at least comment on that somewhat objectively. No need for instant gratification. Patience is powerful!

    Nice set of posts too!

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  3. #212

    Hybrid or Diesel?

    To EX EV driver...I dont know how u know future
    hybrids will be so kow on maintenance. I know
    my manual says the TDI need oilchange every
    100000 miles. Just put on a new timingbelt(new TDis has a chain) good for 100000 miles.
    If u have read one of my earlier input I mentioned
    that my brothers oldest MB a 95 C-class diesel
    passed 500000kilometers and never had any engine
    work done. Its still runs great. Any comments?
    Anyhow are u saying that any garage can troubleshoot the motors and electronics on a hybrid?

  4. #213

    Hybrid or Diesel?

    Anyhow within the next 2-3 year our government
    will have woken up and realized that clean diesels
    is the solution until something better comes around.
    Take a look ay ads for used TDIs and then u will realize how popular they are. The resale price is
    very high

  5. #214

    Hybrid or Diesel?

    Steve - did you look at the last link I provided? The E320 CDI achieved a certified 49.9 mpg. I suspect they were driving for maximum fuel economy, but nearly 50 mpg and over 1000 miles on one tank of fuel isn't bad for a car in that class. I was just responding to MOS's challenge.

    I hope I'm not coming across as bashing hybrids because that's not my intention. It's just that diesels are better in certain driving situations in my opinion (I live in a rural/small town location). I'd like to see more diesels available in the U.S. than just a $50K Mercedes or a few VW TDI models.

  6. #215

    Hybrid or Diesel?

    Thanks wxman.
    49MPG is truly impressive, about the same as hybird.

    I too live in a small rural community and commute about 100 miles to/from work.
    Because the Civic Hybrid is a great highway car I fill up about evey 8-9 days.

    But I don't fill the 21 gallons required for the E320 CDI.
    I only fill 13-14 gallons.

    At $3.00/g that's about $20.00 hybrid savings per fill.

  7. #216

    Hybrid or Diesel?

    "I'm exceeding 800 miles with my Civic Hybrids 13-14 gallon tank. "

    I get about 800 routinely on our Jetta, with about 16 gallons of fuel. I've had as low as 600 on the same amount, on a long road trip with bikes on a roof rack and the wagon area packed to the ceiling (aerodynamics applies to hybrids as well...)

    However it has one advantage over your Civic.

    It's a station wagon. Which makes it an SUV beater! It has all the capacity and convenience of, say, a Honda CRV-sized SUV, but with double the fuel efficiency. The only thing the SUV has over it is ground clearance, and all-wheel drive (rarely a necessity except for the woods).

    So far nobody that I know makes a hybrid station wagon or SUV that comes anywhere near that kind of efficiency. A Passat wagon is even more practical (size-wise), competing with an Escape hybrid or eve larger for practicality, with 40 mpg real-world highway fuel efficiency (something the Escape does not appear able to achieve). But the Passat is of course less efficient than the Jetta on fuel.

  8. #217

    Hybrid or Diesel?

    wxman- thanks for the info and the response. Well respected and good information. Solid.

  9. #218

    Hybrid or Diesel?

    According to a Dutch study the enviromental
    drawbacks with making a hybrid, batteries, 2 motors, electronics and disposal outweighs any
    advantage (there was none to begin with) over the
    much simpler to build DI diesel car.
    Maintenance for hybrids are also expected to be
    very expensive and likely to happen.
    The Dutch goverment hired an independant contractor to study
    this. FYI

  10. #219

    Hybrid or Diesel?


    I'd like to see that study.
    Batteries are non-toxic and recyclable, and maintenance is same as any other car.

  11. #220

    Hybrid or Diesel?

    a quote

    "Hybrid buyers are often disappointed that they don't get the fuel economy numbers listed on the window sticker in their regular driving. "I just love my Honda Civic Hybrid, but I have been a bit disappointed that the gas mileage isn't better," says Ivey Doyal of Atlanta, Georgia.

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