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  1. #41

    Hybrid or Diesel?

    Bio works well in engines with an injector pump. All the talk one sees about the "grease" cars all are older diesels which can burn pure vegetable oil. It does have to be heated up to thin it out before the engine can accept it. Most of the 100% Bio burners start on diesel until the oil tank can be heated with hot water from the engine cooling system. So, any diesel made up until about 2002 can burn most oils and bio fuels.

    However, a few years ago most diesels started using a common rail injection system, much like the ones on most modern cars. The system basically runs a high pressure line to the injectors. The injectors are electrically operated and open on signal. They don’t like Bio as much. If you have been running standard diesel, which builds up sludge, and then run Bio, which acts a cleaner, it can clog up the filters and injectors.

    Daimler - Chrysler has addressed this with new diesels they are marketing. The new Jeep Liberty we have is a Common Rail Diesel (if you see a Liberty with a “CRD” badge on the tailgate in lieu of the 3.7L badge, then it is a diesel). It came from the factory with BD5 (5%) and is advertised in the brochure as Bio-Diesel compatible. However, the information for my Dodge truck, which has the Cummins Diesel, does not recommend or say not to burn bio. It only says any damage from running bio would not be covered under warranty. Evidently there are some caustic elements in the bio fuels that can eat away at the seals and cause internal corrosion of the fuel system. Also, as Bio tends to clean out the gunk, this can cause the clogs.

    If you buy Bio-Diesel from a gas station in lieu if the homemade stuff, it typically has the correct additives in it that prevent the problems. Here in the upstate some of the stations sell “Willie-Bio”, which is a product that Willie Nelson distributes to help the American farmers. We run BD20 in our Jeep and BD2 in our Dodge. The bio seems to work ok with no reduction in mileage.

    South Carolina

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  3. #42

    Hybrid or Diesel?

    The newer (2004 and later) VW TDIs are not common rail, but rather use a unit injector system (called "Pump-Düse" in marketing speak).

    The injector is its own high-pressure fuel pump. The injector is pressurized by a special camshaft. Each stroke builds the same pressure but the fuel metering is handled by the electronics, similar to a common-rail system.

    I'm not sure how these handle bio. I believe VW allows up to 20% bio, but I'm not sure.

    VW may be going to a common rail system in the future. With unit injection, you're more limited on adjusting injection timing.

  4. #43

    Hybrid or Diesel?

    Hello i'm researching hybrid vehicles for a school assignment and I was wondring if you could tell me where you work. It is one of my requirments to complete the whole projet.

  5. #44

    Hybrid or Diesel?

    Cody, which one of us do you want to know where they work? There's a dozen or so different correspondents in this thread.

  6. #45

    Hybrid or Diesel?

    To get reliable info on durability of gasoline cars
    versus diesel cars one need to look to Europe
    where practically all manufacturers offer diesel
    engines in the cars and the market is about
    50-50 gas and diesel. I do not have numbers to show, but I know the diesel engines in Toyotas, Nissan, VW, MB, BMW, Fords, Citroens even Chryslers last forever with little maintenance except oil change. Some of them use timing belts
    while others use the chain just like gas engines.
    The future in engines is diesel for years to come
    not just because the engines are better anf give more mpg, but natural abundant natural gas can
    be turned into "green" diesel. Just look up "GTL"
    Gas to liquid diesel. Bjorn

  7. #46

    Hybrid or Diesel?

    Under "Environment" and its subcategory "Pollutants"
    the Jetta 1.9l (diesel) is compared to Honda Civic
    hybrid in emitting nitrogen oxides. This is a diesel
    engines worst category due to high sulphur content
    in US diesel. Why not show the Jettas exellent
    performance in the CO2 category?
    No doubt this website is supported by the
    hybrid industry.

  8. #47

    Hybrid or Diesel?

    Just to throw in my 2 cents worth on this opinion,
    I would definately prefer a diesel car (in the US you are limited to Mercedes or Jetta) than any
    of the currently hybrids (Prius, Insight) on the
    basis of crash safety alone. There is absolutely
    no way I am putting my family in a prius, period.

    The economics of hybrids also burns me up because
    hybrid owners are asking me and everyone else
    to subsidize their driving through tax incentives.
    Diesel cars make no such request. I also think
    (I'm sure someone will get me if I'm wrong) that
    no one is making a profit off of these cars yet.
    If this is true, added to the subsidy issue, the last
    country I recall experimenting with a centrally
    planned and dictated technology path failed

    Solve the issue of 'dirty fuel' and diesel is the
    answer to most of America's energy problems
    right now, today. It isn't some faux hybrid/
    hydrogen fantasy. The cars reduce energy
    requirements at every stage of the game.

    Just my 2 cents like I said, and for once in my
    life I agree with the Europeans, which I do find
    it odd that on any other issue, the greenies
    blindly follow the Euro lead without any scientific
    evidence required, but on the diesel/hybrid issue
    they go to inquisition levels of research?


  9. #48

    Hybrid or Diesel?

    I'm gonna add my opinion, despite the probablity that it'll never be read.

    1) There are no hybrid wagons yet.
    I was going to test drive a 2006 Civic hybrid, but its utility is extremely limited to someone that likes hauling bicycles and ski equipment around.

    2) Looking at used car listings is a terrible way to determine car longevity. For one thing, the Japanese car makers have a much greater market share than VW does BY FAR. The pages and pages of people selling their Toyotas and Hondas is merely a reflection of their popularity. As such, there are going to be more statistical outliers -- the cars that have an enormous number of kilometres on them. As well, people that buy VWs MAY (I don't know, this is speculation) be less likely to sell them. They may also be more likely to drive them off of cliffs or take them to the wreckers'. The problem is that there are too many variables and statistical variations to claim that a used car listing is giving you an accurate representation of how long a car is likely to last.

    3) Diesel engines aren't dirty, diesel fuel is dirty, which is an important distinction. In Europe, where the laws governing diesel fuel are more strict, the vehicles emit fewer pollutants.

    4) Hopefully everyone can agree that if we all drove diesels and hybrids, the planet would be far better off than in the situation we see it now. Less fighting, more congratulating for the good choices that we all seem to be making!

  10. #49

  11. #50

    Hybrid or Diesel?

    J.S., I haul bicycles around on a weekly basis on my 2003 Honda Civic Hybrid with a strap-on trunk-lid-mounted bike carrier. I haul a kayak occasionally using a Yakima clip-on roof rack, which doubles as a snowboard carrier and even an IKEA bookshelf carrier. The "limited utility" you mention has an easy work-around.

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