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  1. #151
    Guest

    Diesel vs. Hybrid: A Point Missed

    Bjorn,

    If it was a plug-in hybrid (diesel or gasoline), and you have pv on the roof, you have a lifetime (free) fuel supply at home (or at least 20 years while the PV is under warrantee).

    While we're on the subject of stored fuel, if it is CNG or propane powered, it is even easier and safer to store fuel at home. You'd better check with local authorities, however, before storing a huge quantity of any of these fuels though.

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  3. #152
    Guest

    Diesel vs. Hybrid: A Point Missed

    ex EV1 driver.

    I dont know if you that diesel is exactly the same
    as heating oil and it is much safer than propane and much easier to store. Here in the NE most homes use heating oil. Some people have a 275gls
    'capacity. Some have 1100m gls legally.
    If a propane tank leaks you are in danger. Should a tank of diesel leak there is no danger. If you have a choice of holding a lit match near leaking
    propane or leaking diesel I think the choice is clear. yes it is legal to store heating oil and diesel fuel in this community. If your does not permit it, but allow propane then there is something wrong.
    PV systems to charge car is fine, but what is the range?. I dont know if you remember the gasoline
    line during the 1973 embargo? I do and i would have felt great having a diesel powered car and
    have the fuel at home tanking up in my driveway
    being number 1 in line while everone else is
    lining up the local station.
    Doesnt this make sense? Such a simple off the shelf solution until a new technology is readely available.
    Still waiting for Steves comment on the storage
    at home

  4. #153
    Guest

    Diesel vs. Hybrid: A Point Missed

    Steve, EV1 and others please pull up link below
    and see which fuel is safest to store..

    http://www.grnet.com/therhinosuite/y...gaspropane.htm

  5. #154
    Guest

    Diesel vs. Hybrid: A Point Missed


  6. #155
    Guest

    Diesel vs. Hybrid: A Point Missed


  7. #156
    Guest

    Diesel vs. Hybrid: A Point Missed

    Bjorn,

    Yep, I lived in the northeast in the '70's, drove a diesel Rabbit, lived in a house with oil heat stored in a tank in the ground [and you can't make me admit to running the Rabbit from fuel that hadn't had road tax paid on it ;-) ]. You've never seen a post from me that is negative about diesel (if burned cleanly).

    That was the '70's and we got past Nixon, disco, and leisure suits so we need to get past pure diesel ICE as well since that, too has been improved.

    I've just seen and driven the future and its primary power source is battery powered electric with ICE only as a potential backup for occasional long trips.

    The most range I've ever done on one charge with a battery EV was 140 miles in an NiMH powered EV1 [ RIP 2003 :-( ]. Today, the practical limitation to battery EV's is about 200 miles using Li-ion batteries.

    The ease of home charging of a BEV or PHEV is such that the range per charge only affects long road trips, never day-to-day or week-to-week use.

  8. #157
    Guest

    Diesel vs. Hybrid: A Point Missed

    "Still waiting for Steves comment on the storage
    at home"
    Thanks Bjorn.
    I am not allowed to store that quantity of fuel within city limits, not even fuel oil for heating. Existing tanks remain as long as they are inspected regularly but no new ones are placed.

    A few notes back you were (Rightly) happy with your 600 mile range.
    Last tank I've cleared almost 850miles for calculated 63.83MPG. Next tank likely similar.
    Comments on that?

    I think the Jetta TDI is likely the closest diesel comparisson to my HCH. Last summer averaged about 65 with one tank running 941 miles. If you know of anyone who is currently getting these results in the TDI, **PLEASE** let me know how to get hold of them so we can "Swap notes".
    I think it would be a good debate and educational for all as well.

  9. #158
    Guest

    Diesel vs. Hybrid: A Point Missed

    Its a great mileage and clearly better than my 2002
    TDI. My trips are all a mix of going to work 15 miles each way and local driving which give me 45mpg average. We usually use my wifes gasoline
    Passat when we go on trips since it is roomier, but
    on two trips upstate NY I got 54mpg.
    The list price for the TDI version is about $900 more than the similar gasoline car. I think that is
    an advantage compared to the hybrid.
    The advantage of knowing I have my own fuel at
    home is very reassuring for me who experienced
    the 1973 crises. I dont know why some communities does not allow diesel or heating oil
    stored at home, but approve flammable propane!!
    Does not make sense and should be changed.
    Did anyone ever hear about a tank of diesel explode in a home? I dont think so, but natural gas
    or propane explosions we all know happens.
    So Georgia lawmakers should encourage the
    safe storage of stratigic supplies of diesel at home.
    As before mentioned diesel requires less energy to
    and cost to produce as well.
    If hybrid batteries turn out to be lang lasting and
    trouble free it would be nice to see a diesel/electric
    hybrid. When car is parked at home it could get
    supplemented with solar energy from the house
    and/or have a solar panel for charging when car
    is in parking lot at work. However the hybrid drivetrain is much more complicated than the
    gas or diesel combustion engine so that is a cost
    issue.
    Another possibility is to have an all electric car
    for local driving/work commute and leave the
    gas or diesel at home. Most of us commute less than 20 miles and that should be feasable with an
    electric car. Maybe insurance companies could base
    their rate on only one car used at a time and cover
    both for one rate. Should be possible with satellite
    tracking system. Besides saved fuel we would
    also get cleaner air and less money for certain
    terrorist groups.
    cost to produce as well.

  10. #159
    Guest

    Diesel vs. Hybrid: A Point Missed

    Forgot to comment on "TDI is closest to my car"
    Probably true in the US, but practically every carmaker sell their cars with diesel engines in the
    rest of the world and has for many years.
    Toyota has too at least for 30 years. They came
    out with a brand new diesel engine which is highly
    rated. So does Chryseler 300 CRD built in Austria,
    but not sold in the US!!!!!!!!!!!
    So there are dozens of diesels to compare with, but
    only 2 here.

  11. #160
    Guest

    Diesel vs. Hybrid: A Point Missed

    I can't imagine they'd have an issue with storing fuel in places like farming communities etc but I guess they figure heat pumps and natural gas are enough for the city I live in.
    Who knows they probably own shares of those and lining their pockets or political chests.

    I apologize for not having any details to post but I've heard Honda has a nice diesel engine and planning to sell here sometime.

    With gas prices pushing $3.00 again our Grand Caravan stays parked unless hauling things or taking along more than our five passengers.
    We figured the added cost of low 20's MPG does not justify its extra roominess so we all jump in the Honda.
    With all five of us on board and using scaled back efficiency methods I get mid, sometimes upper 50's MPG in the Honda.

    We'll probably replace the GC in a couple of years. Perhaps with a EV if they make one (And affordable etc)....maybe a Prius.
    If Honda sells that diesel then we might end up with one of those.
    The future is so uncertain.
    I really think the solution for commuters is a EV charged by nuclear on the grid.
    Maybe someday.

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