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  1. #11

    Bob, You're throwing things

    Bob,

    You're throwing things out that I never saw in chemistry class so I'm deferring to higher authorities before declaring it to be meaningless technobabble that you or someone else made up. If you have a minute, you might go back and try to help me understand what this HHO stuff you refer to really is from a traditional physical chemistry perspective. Is it a molecule of some kind?
    I'll try to get back to you in a few days, after I've consulted with others who are smarter than me. I'm lucky to be able to hang out with some of the smartest people in the world so I'll see if I can pursuade some of them to help me debunk your scheme. Most of them won't give you the time of day but they may help me out.
    Regarding my brusk nature, I only agreed to deal with your statements, even though I believe them to be unfounded. I will try to avoid any name calling but I do reserve the right to call things as I see them. I will try to avoid superflous name calling but "ignorant", "scam", and "fraud" are not just names if they are true, whether or not someone likes them.
    I grow tired of people selling perpetual motion machines (like bumper propellers with generators to charge the batteries in an EV) , unobtanium reactors, conveniently missed details, the Brooklyn Bridge, and other fantasy schemes shaming and scaring well intentioned investors when we really need that capital to find solutions to our planet's very real energy problems.

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  3. #12
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
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    "Most of them won't give you

    "Most of them won't give you the time of day but they may help me out."

    Are you really this pompous? You have no idea who will and who won't give me the time of day. I constantly consult with others who are brilliant in their fields and am working with some now to take our company to the next phase. We have companies and investors who see the viability of our products.

    While you spend your time trying to debunk what I do, I'm experimenting, building and testing better and more efficient models, installing them in vehicles, and getting referrals because of positive results.

    I have no more time to deal with you and your arrogance if this is your only goal. I will use my time to actually work on developing things that will help our world- what are you doing except spending your time cutting down others that don't fit your pre-concieved notions?

    I thought I could get an intelligent conversation going- something that appears to be impossible with you.

    Bob

  4. #13

    Ok, I give up. Your

    Ok,
    I give up. Your explanation of HHO makes no sense to me or the Chemstry Professors I've spoken with.
    Hydrogen is a pretty simple element and it is highly unlikely that there are any unknown stable molecules that can be created from it that people familiar with traditional chemistry don't know about.
    I guess you've found some sort of new chemistry.
    Again, call me pompous to deflect the fact that I'm calling your bluff but read your own posts first and you'll probably find us both in the pompous category but I have a long record of successful technological accomplishments and I doubt that you do (not that I know who you are).
    I don't profess to know everything, nor do I claim that my sources do either (that's not too pompous is it?).
    In my mind, there's about a 99% chance that you're promoting just another snake oil, perpetual motion scheme. Show it to me or get a neutral 3rd party to certify your claims and I'll believe you. Why don't you schedule a public demonstration of your system at Hybridfest 2009 (Madison, WI) or Alt Car Expo (Santa Monica, CA) next year as I'm going to try to be at both of these.
    I won't trouble you with any further discussions on your scheme or any other similar ones.

  5. #14
    Guest

    Hi Bob, I'm not smart

    Hi Bob,
    I'm not smart just mechanically inclined. I don't believe your advertising a scam here. I think that the average person doesn't know enough science to understand the chemistry invovled in this process. And your always going to have "smart" guys that would rather verbally debate you then actually try to physically refute what you trying to do here. My question is if I buy one of these kits and I'm not satisfied will I be refunded and If I am satisfied and keep the the kit, what is the durability and life span of one of these. Have you had enough R+D to even know what the life span is? Any feedback would be appreciated, I will not come back to you with skepticism and try to question every answer you have. Thanks for your time and consideration.

  6. #15
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    0

    Hi Shaun, I have no problem

    Hi Shaun,
    I have no problem answering any questions regarding this technology as long as people are willing to have an open minded, intelligent discussion.
    To answer your questions, We offer a one year warranty on current models and guarantee mileage increase or you can take the kit out and send it back for a refund.

    The Hydrogen Generator Kits are quite durable made with high quality 316L stainless steel plates and will last for many years - can be transferred from one car to the next. The only maintenance required is to flush and re-fill with fresh distilled water and electrolyte about every three months (just like an oil change), this keeps the thing running at maximum efficiency.

    If you have any other questions, feel free to ask.

    Bob
    Transitional Technologies, LLC

  7. #16
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
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    0

    Great Idea! I've contacted

    Great Idea! I've contacted both of them to inquire about exhibitor prices. We are factoring 2-4 exhibits a year into our business plan. Thanks for the heads up. I'll let you know if we are able to attend - love to show you what we have in person, with a vehicle on hand.

    I love the idea of the MPG contest at hybridfest. I asked them what the requirements are there as well, since the best demo is real life competition.

    Bob
    Transitional Technologies, LLC

  8. #17

    Hi all, While I came down

    Hi all,
    While I came down pretty hard on hybridman2, I've continued to dig further into what the introduction of hydrogen into an ICE cylinder would do.
    Unfortunately, I can't find anything quantitative or substantive, but, there is some evidence that hydrogen may help, as hybridman2 says with the gasoline-air combustion. Likewise, a little water in the cylinder may help too but it can destroy the cylinders.
    Making up silly names like HHO or "Brown's gas", doesn't help anything.
    My suggestion for Transitional Technologies is to cut the HHO/Brown's gas nomenclature and get with traditional science. Also, I suggest you cut the attempts to generate Hydrogen (H2) onboard and carry a small tank of H2. Then compare the fuel efficiency gain of simply injecting the H2 into your engine and not injecting it. You can also determine the quantitative benefit of how much H2 should be injected. This should determine the value of the H2, then, the only issue will be: what is the best way to get your H2. I'll bet that some cheesy onboard generator is not the best way but I'll look forward to your witnessed results.

  9. #18
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    0

    Actually, introducing pure

    Actually, introducing pure hydrogen into a normal ICE engine is not good, at least in quantities that would matter. It has to be compressed to be stored- when it it released into the engine it expands and is extremely cold- this can cause embrittlement to the interior of the engine.

    Just so you know Ex-EV1, I didn't invent the name HHO. If you want to do some research- look into Yull Brown who is the researcher that discovered its unique properties in the late 60's. Until recently it was more commonly called "Brown's Gas". He also was the one who discovered what traditional science would not - it's OK to allow the remixing of H and O after separating them into their constituent gases.

    Cheesy generators- nice. We wouldn't have even been distributing yet if it were not for the demand for our products. If you think we are resting there you are as mistaken as your assumptions.

    We are currently designing commercial grade models that will blow away the handmade units being sold around the world. We are in negotiations with an auto manufacturer about designing an OEM unit for their vehicles (unfortunately not one of the Big 3). We are developing a vehicle system for the coming Xprize competition.

    What are doing except griping and moaning that it can't be done. Thank God you weren't around when the wright brothers were working on their plane - of course there were plenty of engineers like you back then that were shouting loudly it wouldn't fly. Do you realize how closely your own accusations sounds to back then?

    IS this niche perfected? Not by a long shot. Are there still breakthroughs that need to happen? You bet. Same thing in every alternative technology available today. We need better batteries, better motors, more efficient ICE's and combustion processes. That's our goal. That's what we are striving for.

    Or we could just bury our head in the sand and shout expletives at anyone that tries something new.

    Why don't you focus your anger on someone else for awhile- like the BIg 3 that can't keep up with technology breakthroughs and yet have their hand out again for more money...

    Transitional Technologies, LLC
    Hybrid Water Power is a transitional technology


  10. #19
    Guest

    if all this is true why does

    if all this is true why does shell hydrogen enriched fuel inprove my fuel economy

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