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08-03-2008 06:07 AM #101
There have been some
There have been some interesting posts in this thread, so here's my $0.02. The techniques that have been mentioned do work in my 07 HCH. I've had 55-58mpg per full tank for six months now driving 45 miles per workday. I keep the tire pressure around 40psi and check it weekly. Maintenance is done at the dealer (part of the purchase). I don't use cruise control and avoid using the A/C while accelerating onto interstates and climbing hills. Recently I noticed that FE doesn't drop with windows down at 55-60mph but it definitely drops when the A/C is on. The 1,100 rpm acceleration works well on residential streets with light traffic. I'm no MSantos, but I think I've had good mileage long enough to say it's not a fluke. Best of luck... and the best part is that it still drives like a Civic (had a 98 EX that lasted 149K with 40mpg highway).
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08-05-2008 01:29 AM #102
Okay, I had to drive 750
I had to drive 750 miles over the weekend on a trip to LA from Phoenix. I have no issues with the car but i am not happy with the mpg calculation of HCH II. Based on all the calculations I have done on the HCHII mpg indicator, I am 100% certain that HCH II mpg calculation it is totally wrong. Honda should calculate the mpg by measuring the spent fuel and the odometer reading and then calculating the average mpg and not by the current mpg measurements based on how you drive ( of course driving will have an impact on FE but should not be used for calculation purposes).
The reading that you see is completely based on the law of averages. Let me explain this with a scenario assuming that you are on a full gas tank and your trip reading indicator is reset to zero before you start:
Let's say you drive the first 300 miles at 50 mpg (based on the mpg indicator) and then say another 125 miles at 35 mpg under rough weather ( may be you started climbing hills, hit a strong headwind etc.). Since you have the first 300 miles at 50 mpg, you have built up a good average mpg. Now if you start driving the next 125 miles where there is enormous fuel consumption, the mpg indicator will start to go down. But due to the law of averages, the mpg indicator still shows you a better reading than actual as you have driven the first 70% of your distance at a greater FE and only the next 30% with a bad mileage. You would have spent enormous amount of gas in the 125 mile stretch. The car mpg indicator does not have any means to account for that.
For instance (under very similar scenario): My car was showing 48 mpg but my actual ended up at 42 mpg when i filled the tank and worked on my calculation.
Honda should eliminate this way of calculation. EPA estimates must be based on the mpg indicator ( i presume) which is faulty and I blame Honda for that. The best and the accurate way of calculation is to measure the fuel spent and the mileage driven. This can be automated with level sensors in the fuel tank and I am surprised why Honda ended up getting this totally wrong. May be that would make them sell more cars? ( perhaps)
08-06-2008 08:24 AM #103
Extremely Frustrated! I'm
Extremely Frustrated! I'm getting (a combined 60/40 city/highway) 30mpg. Been to the dealer 2 times with the IMA malfunctioning, and was told it has been upgraded and is working properly now. Both rear upper arm stabilizers replaced at a cost of 4 new tires to me 0w20 back into the motor as suggested by the dealer, even though the book states it's ok for the 5w20. Tires swelled to their maximum 44 cpsi. Driving like Granma Moses. Was told by the dealer first that my mpg was down due to ethanol in the fuel? It's had ethanol since it was a baby at 30 miles when we drove it off the lot. Then we were told it's because of the heavy oil (corrected) then we were told it's because of the lack of stop n go driving which was not charging my main IMA battery, and could be corrected if I pulled over and put the car in neutral and revved the motor to 2k and held it for 2 minutes? (this makes no sense to me? on a "green" car?) I have tryed changing my driving style and all the fuel economy tips stated above.
Not trying to rant, I really like this car but I'm finding out a few things that I don't look forward to. Can only run the high dollar "low friction" tires, has 8 spark plugs that must be double iridium in order to obtain good FE ( these things are expensive!) Main IMA battery is good for a 5-7 yr lifespan(how expensive are these? and do the old ones go into the landfill? Again "green"???) Auto shutoff (i like) but it's wearing on the starter every time it starts! With these added expenses I think it would be worth better than 30 mpg?
Is this just a lemon that the dealer won't accept that anything is wrong with it or am I just too much of a wanton wisher that I'd like the 40+mpg that it claimed on the sticker?!
08-06-2008 09:55 AM #104
I have a 2006 Civic Hybrid.
I have a 2006 Civic Hybrid. It has never topped 40 MPG. Lately my MPG has dropped below 30 MPG. I have gotten new tires, had the fuel injection system serviced and switched to no alcohol gas. All to no avail. The pick up has also gotten worse. Very frustrating to say the least. Every time I take it in to get it serviced I get a letter from the dealer saying they are interested in buying small cars in good condition. I am thinking of taking them up on it.
08-06-2008 10:09 AM #105
LouisO, I'm having no
LouisO, I'm having no problems with my hybrid, so I'm curious as to how you're driving it.
Do you use the AC?
Do you use cruise control?
How fast do you drive when on the highway?
How high do you let your RPMs get when accelerating?
I use the AC set to Auto with the temp set to 80. (It was 100F here in KC today).
I do *not* use cruise control, instead I keep my RPMs at a constant 2000 RPM while hill climbing, and just accept that my speed will drop. If it's a big hill, I'll hit the gas to avoid dropping under 55 MPH.
My average speed on the highway is 62-65MPH.
I keep RPMs under 2500 while accelerating to highway speeds.
Here is my fuel log for the past year:
08-06-2008 10:28 AM #106
LouisO, I forgot to answer
LouisO, I forgot to answer some of your questions.
The IMA control system will automatically charge the traction battery when needed. No need to put it into neutral and rev. Whomever gave you that advice was wrong. Revving the engine in neutral might charge the battery but it will also waste a ton of gas.
Old batteries are recycled. No landfill for them.
Autostop doesn't wear the starter at all since the conventional starter isn't used to restart from autostops. The starter should last as long or longer than on a conventional car.
5W20 oil will work but 0W20 is recommended.
Start and stop driving can be good for FE or bad for FE depending on how start and stop it is. If the stops are short enough for you to simply glide without slowing down or actually stopping, it's good for FE. If the stops are long enough that you have to actually stop, it's bad for FE. Highway cruising though should do really well. On a level stretch of highway doing 62 MPH, I can cruise with MPG in the 70's. As for the CC, I don't use it because it will waste gas attempting to maintain a constant speed on hills.
I would also recommend using the AC when first get the car started on a hot day. You need to cool the battery pack down so that it will charge and so that it can help you save fuel.
As for it being a lemon and the dealer not wanting to take responsibility. It's possible. You definately have a dealer that seems to be of poor quality (judging from their advice to shift into neutral and gun the engine for 2 minutes). If you are in a city with some of the regular posters here, or at CleanMPG, you might see you can setup a meeting and have one of them drive your vehicle to see if it's up to snuff.
08-08-2008 06:07 PM #107
- Join Date
- Oct 2006
Hi LouisO: Like DSharp said,
Like DSharp said, there are quite a few things wrong with what you said regarding the hybrid technology in these cars and its longevity. Perhaps most of it was fed to you by people who know little or nothing about these cars. Unfortunately there are still too many of these folks pushing this embarrassing stuff around. If your dealer is the source of this garbage then please, donlt walk out of there... RUN, RUN away from them ASAP and seek another dealer as lack of technical education of their part is something you cannot afford.
Anyhow, enough with the garbage and on with the good stuff.
There may several reasons why you get just 30 MPG during the summer months. We would like to help you solve your problem if you can help us understand the reasons along the way. OK?
First, lets start with the obvious questions (MaryAnn please answer these too):
- what type of traffic do you drive in (%city /%highway)?
- what is the average trip duration?
- what are your driving speeds?
- do you have an alternate dealer to go to?
- what is your current tire pressure rating (sidewall pressure)?
- what is your current tire pressure on EACH of the tires?
- what is the rating of the oil in your car at the moment?
- have you read Tarabell's article particularly understanding how to properly use the hybrid specific gauges you paid for (this is VERY important)?
Final notes: Never, never contemplate putting in 5w20 oil in the engine. Such oil weight is only recommended in case the 0W20 is not available (emergency scenario).
08-12-2008 09:20 PM #108
trust me you made a better
trust me you made a better choice. Honda is better. As far as gas miles how many miles are on the car when you got it. (you can email me firstname.lastname@example.org)
So did it have over 50,000. First get emission pass. It comes in a can, It made for passing emissions,it goes in the gas tank. It says use a full tank of gas. less than half is ok.
The can is either in a box which is square. or just the can and its a steel can not tin.
Make sure it say emissions, there is one out there that says use every 3000 miles don't use that one. It should cost about $8.00 -$10 the most. Use that - it the miles are more than 50,000
and what state are you in . that makes a big difference. so back to miles over 50, then do this again but not at the next tank fill up but the one after, tires check ok - go to the engine
check the wires-look for cracks or oil. look @ night it you see a light show-lights\flashing around the engine - change the wires, You See the state makes a difference -the temp
either dries out the wires or cracks them. its a hybrid then make sure the oil is zero
weight- big difference - so it would be - 0w -10, now the state makes a difference
the second number is important too. if it cold there 40 would be too heavy -you would have
to wait longer to warm up. Use synthetic its better and last longer. so warn state use lower number like 5 - so it would be 0w-5- and change the filter too also change air filter car need
air. Do this and let me know how it goes.
08-15-2008 11:16 PM #109
Honda has a Service Bulletin
Honda has a Service Bulletin out now for all 2006, 2007, and some 2008 Honda Civics that should help with this problem.
The Service Bulletin is dated 11 April 2008 and replaces faulty trailing arms that are causing the tires to wear significantly. This also affects the fuel economy of the car greatly.
The Service Bulletin is #08-001. Most dealers have the part in stock to fix this issue.
I hope this helps someone.
08-23-2008 12:01 AM #110
I've had my '08 HCH for
I've had my '08 HCH for ~3000 miles now and I'm getting 44.5 MPG (mostly city driving). On one trip (mostly highway), I went 200 miles and got 54 MPG.
To those of you averaging less than 40MPG on the highway, you need to drive LESS than 65 MPH. This is not a problem with hybrids, simply a matter of physics. Due to wind resistance, the engine has to work harder going from 55 to 65, than from 45 to 55. Driving is not a race, so put your testosterone in neutral and grow up.