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  1. #21
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007

    Hi MSantos... My Honda

    Hi MSantos... My Honda Dealer Manager told me just last week that "as a courtesy to your car, you should warm the car up before you drive it???" You say the opposite. I have warmed it up a few times but hardly enough to warrant such low gas mileage. I have stopped that practice.

    I drive solely with the gauges, and I am really a very conservative driver. I took my car on a highway trip last week, and managed to get 30.3 MPG's on the highway. I was faithful to Cruise Control, placed the car in neutral on the hills, drove within speed limit... so I am really PO'd here.

    The Dealer has put the correct oil in the engine, or at least that's what they wrote on the invoice. The Dealer is more than willing to work with me, and have the car checked out thoroughly.

    I continue to have window problems, having had the driver's window lubed about 4 times, the most recent in December. On my recent trip, the window refused to go up on the highway. It took several attempts. Its really annoying me now, because they told me the problem has been fixed.

    I'll keep you updated.

    I don't feel comfortable giving you my information, or the car's info, invoice #, dealer etc, as I do not know you... and feel more comfortable working with the dealer. Hope you understand.

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  3. #22
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2006

    Gman1964: The more I read


    The more I read your posts, the more I realize there's much more room for improvement.

    You are not only doing many bad things already that kill the fuel economy, but you also have a dealer that is likely the worst and most technically inept dealer in the nation I've had heard of. It makes a remote and low volume dealer in Saskatchewan look VERY good.

    As I said in another post in addition to a few other tips.
    -Do not put the transmission on N in hills. Instead, use regeneration and glide your car at every opportunity.
    -Avoid the use of the cruise control on hilly terrain. instead use DWL.
    -Pump up your tires (40 in the front and 38 in the rear)
    -Drive by the gauges (As per Tarabell's article)
    -Avoid exceeding 2000 RPM when cruising and 2500 RPM when climbing small hills.
    -Change your oil according to Honda's directions with SAE 0W20 grade.
    -DO NOT warm-up idle your engine, Please !!
    -Write a letter for Honda Canada and describe your dealer experience and tell them of the dealer's recommendations.
    -Have your oil analyzed before changing it. I am willing to bet that it is not 0W20.
    -Use the block heater, please !!!
    -Block your front grille in the colder days.
    -Please, read AND understand Tarabell's article.

    Gman, I only asked you for the invoice number.
    I specifically asked that you provide NO OTHER information. The invoice number will allow me to look up the service details and determine what has been observed and recorded by the dealer.
    Doing this is the next step in determining how to best and quickly end your pains

    Take care.


  4. #23
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007

    Dear MSantos... I really

    Dear MSantos... I really appreciate your feedback. I have been listening carefully to my service manager and dealer manager. I am left to conclude that they really are not too educated on Hybrids. I bought the hybrid because I wanted to make a difference in the environment. I have been given terrible advice and wrong information for 1 1/2 years. I have serviced the car at their advice when the oil life was 30% (5000 miles), and then 40% (10000 miles)... and when I received the car back, the oil life was still 40%... they didn't even reset it. Another trip! I assume they are using the correct oil. After each service, the gas mileage suffered badly.

    I was advised to warm-up the car... and that's wrong. I may have done it 3 times total in 18 months. So that wouldn't affect my overall gas mileage. My car is parked every night in a garage, so its not that cold in the mornings. That practice has stopped. I was told by a service man there, to place the car in "N" going down steep hills. I may have done that 6 times in 18 months, twice last week. So I can't see that as having such a devastating difference in my overall gas mileage in 18 months.

    I am faithful to the guages, especially when accelerating, starting off etc. I noticed that the IMA Dial R/1000 on the Dash has been set to "1" since the last service, so it never goes below "1"??? Is that normal? I did have a software update, and that was supposed to solve all my problems. But it hasn't.

    I have adjusted my bad practices, and I am willing to do everything in my power to booster my fuel economy. I know I am naive, gullible, and tend to listen to perceived experts (such as my dealership)... but if I can't trust them, where do I turn? Whom am I to believe?

    As for my driver's window... it is still not working. I have had it "lubed" 4 times, and told it was corrected. I put the window down on a NY Interstate last week, and it refused to go up. It would go all the way, hit top, and proceed to go down half way. I had to pull the car over on the shoulder, and press in from the outside, to get it to stay on track. I don't like doing this on highways where there are many 18-wheelers.

    My tires are "howling" quite loudly, and that's a new problem the past few months. I asked them to look at it. When I got the car back, it had the exact mileage on the odometer as when I brought the car in. So I know they didn't take it for a test run. Wouldn't that be a normal thing to do?

    Enough ranting. Thanks again MSantos for your input. I appreciate it.


  5. #24
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2006

    Gman1964: Some dealerships


    Some dealerships are poorly run and operate on absolute budgetary and technical minimums. This often causes them to skip on proper equipment, documentation and updated training for their technicians.
    While it may not be easy to spot which dealerships are bad, there are definite tell-tale signs we cannot ignore. I believe you've met all of them already. The key now is to try another dealership that passes your future tests and greater knowledge.

    Don't give up. Please keep us posted on your updates and we certainly wont give up on you either.

    Cheers & good luck.


  6. #25

    I can average over 52 mpg..,

    I can average over 52 mpg.., I posted a photo on my homepage so I could share the excitement!!

    Sure you need to change your driving habits some, but once you figure it out, you'll be smiling past all those gas stations!

    Check out my homepage for some helpful tips.

  7. #26

    See this page for my photo

    See this page for my photo proof of over 52mpg!


  8. #27

    well, i have a 2007 civic

    well, i have a 2007 civic hybrid and with my everyday driving, normal driving, i average 42-45 mpg. there is also times that i save gas by driving 55 mph on cruise control on the freeway and drive off slowly. with that combination, the most i got was 51 mpg. the most miles i put in my 10.5 gal tank was 510 miles. so, i have no complain with my car and im loving it (compared to my previous 21 mpg car).

  9. #28
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2007

    Santos wrote: "You too,

    Santos wrote:

    "You too, Chiludo67. Since you already own an MDX and an NSX (hardly economical and environmentally friendly vehicles) an AT-PZEV hybrid is not a good choice for you either."

    Say, Santos keep your smug pollution limited to Hybrids. The Honda made NSX is over 80% aluminum making it entirely recyclable unlike our hazardous material filled hybrids. At 27 mpg for a sports car I can't complain. Also, last time I checked the MDX is a ULEV that I can take skiing and drive in the snow. Hybrids are wonderful cars, but don't think for a minute as hybrid owners can look down at others as though we are doing better things for the environment because we drive one.

    The best mpg (until electric cars are available) we can obtain does more for the environment than little hybrid badges on the back of cars can ever do. With a pitiful 40mpg the HCH is ok, but not as good as non-hybrids.

  10. #29
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2006

    Chiludo67: You are right.


    You are right. You don't need a hybrid to do your best and if you can get 27 mpg out of your LEV 90's NSX then you do have the skill and knowledge to do better on the HCH.


    The whole idea behind this forum is to provide a form of a community support outlet that extends and complements the hybrid ownership experience.
    Commitment to this goal begins by choosing a vehicle for its merits and have the willingness to use it in the way that was meant by its designers. There are few other cars in the market today that are as sensitive to this level of commitment than the HCH or the Toyota Prius.

    In the end, the benefits also extend far beyond our own personal and selfish benefits to become a series of additional benefits for US ALL. And on this note, until other cleaner automotive platforms arrive such as electric cars, an AT-PZEV car like the HCH or Prius remains by far and above, the top choice we can all make regarding this world and our wallet.

    I suggest you do a little more research regarding "hazardous" materials in a hybrid. You'll find that assertion to be an embarrassing urban myth that has been proven wrong, time and time again.

    On one last note:
    Nobody can stop you from getting only 40 MPG on your vehicle. It is your right if you choose to do so...

    ...just as it is the benefit of all others to achieve 50-80 MPG - that is also what this forum is for as well. And if you look carefully, the last group is pretty large indeed.

    Take care;


  11. #30

    I live in So. Calif. I have

    I live in So. Calif.
    I have a 2006 Civic Hybrid that I bought Jan 2006.
    I've had it for slightly over 2 years now.
    The average from the TIME I BOUGHT IT (over 2 years) has been over 50mpg.
    My "Trip A" (which I haven't reset since I got the car) is usually around 53.6. My "Trip B" (which I reset each time I fill up) has varried anywhere from 48 to 55 BY THE TIME I FILL IT UP AGAIN. That's important. There are times where I drive when I'm only getting 38mpg or 43mpg or something like that. But over the long haul, for each tank of gas (about every 500-600 miles I fill it up) I've managed to get in the 50 range. I've gone over 600 miles per tank more than a few times just to "do" it (making sure of course, that my MPG meter showed I was getting 50+ MPG to make sure I had enough gas).
    I try to keep the car between 60-70 (usually in the 65 range) on the freeway. I don't have the A/C on unless I'm stopped and it's really hot (something I always did anyway even before getting a hybrid, I get a headache with AC on too long). Mileage is always bad when the car is warming up (for instance, stopping at lights for the first 5 mins or so, Auto-Stop won't engage until the car is sufficiently warmed up). But you make up the mileage on the freeway or on the street later when the car is warmed up. I DON'T use the cruise control (you can't get as good mileage). I'm easy on the accel when starting from a stopped light, and I'll cruise to a stop instead of using gas to the last second and slamming on the brakes.
    Very simply it's this: I found that if you drive the HCH the way I drove cars before, I'll get mileage in the low 40s (43, etc). But by doing a few changes (not driving 55, not doing stupid things, but easy changes, like not going over 70, keeping it around 65, coasting, going easy on the accel from stops, being gentle, etc) I've managed to get pretty good mileage. And this isn't a one-way "going downhill" MPG. This is real world MPG over the last 2 years. Sometimes I'm on the street, sometimes on the freeway, sometimes moving fast, sometimes in LA's famous traffic, sometimes flat roads, sometimes very hilly, constant up-down hills in the area north of LA. If you drive smart (maybe not the way you used to, but if you learn how to drive a hybrid) you can get 50MPG on the HCH. My average for about 28,000 miles stays around 53.6 sometimes lower, then it will creep up. Never made it to 54 on the long-term average (highest was 53.9) but have made 55, 56 on the per-tank average. And have also had tanks in the mid 40s. But over the long haul it's been around 53.
    As far as the Prius goes, I personally feel it's a slightly better engineered car, but it was damn uncomfortable for me. For me the HCH is stylish, COMFORTABLE, and fun to drive. And I find myself getting darn good mileage on my HCH so I'm happy (why does Toyota have straight control bars where the window and lock controls are, and Honda thankfully has ones that tilt up where your knees are, giving you more room? I used to drive a friend's Prius, and couldn't stand my knees knocking that annoying plastic bar all the time -- not so on the HCH -- and that comfort level is why I bought the HCH).
    Again, there's no magic fairy dust. If you drive the HCH the way you used to drive your old car, you'll get lower mileage. But by slightly changing the way you drive you can really up the mileage. For those interested, I use 87 octane gas, I avoid places that have stickers saying they oxygenate or use ethanol (even though it might be used anyway unmarked), I use Mobil 1 0W20 oil, and haven't changed the original tires yet. I don't generally check this forum often, just kind of wandered in here, so don't know if I'll be around to reply to any other people's posts, just wanted to add my 2c. But I'm getting pretty good mileage, and I'm happy with my HCH. I had my old non-hybrid Civic for 10.5 years, and if I can get 10 years out of my 2006 HCH, I'd be darn happy too...

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