Hybrid Minivan US Availability?
Created March 17, 2005, at 10:47 am by Anonymous
Anyone know when we can expect the Honda or Toyota minivan to surface in the US. Also, do any of the big 3 have plans for a release soon?
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News item: "Toyota Motor says it expects to export a 40-mile-per-gallon, hybrid-power minivan to the USA to join its Prius gas-electric hybrid sedan. That's about double the fuel economy of a gasoline-only U.S. minivan." - June 2001 (!)
http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/2001-06-15-toyota-minivan.htm
Oops
Now it's 2007 - see the article right here under "CARS" in the light blue box to the left.
I hope I'm wrong, but I recently had an email exchange with Toyota.jp and they said they had no plans to export the Hybrid Van (Estima) to the US for now.
I'm very happy with the performance of my 2001 Mazda MPV. However, I still would like a new minivan later this year. I would only buy a new minivan if it is a hybrid and 4 wheel drive.
I am very interested in this question. I read that the Estima was introduced in Japan in 2001. It was listed at 240 hp and is suppose to get about 40 mpg, though i don't know if that is average. The Estima here in the US is the Sienna and it's bigger - over 300 hp I believe.
How can we get the Estima, just as it is sold?
Is Honda considering a hybrid oddessy?
Who can we write to to urge production of a hybrid minivan? I"m sure they'd sell out in seconds. Either Toyota or Honda a missing the boat!
The technology works in a car why not in a minivan or pickup truck too? Why haven't any of the big auto companies done it? What are they waiting for?
GM & ford are waiting for toyota & honda to do it first....
it's part of their progressive management style.
see ya
steve
I've driven minivans since 1990 and own a 2004 Prius--and would buy a hybrid minivan today if one were available! (Need to seat 6 adults--the Highlander is too small).
I have to say that I am NOT at all impressed with the service I got on the phone trying to get the Toyota Canada guys to tell me when or how I could get a hybrid Sienna or even an imported Estima. They did not even know that it was available in Japan since 2001. They claim not to know of any plans to produce them here in North America and when I asked to talk to someone so I could complain they said that they would register the complaint but it would not likely get looked at seriously... Talk about ignorant. I then called back the Toyota US line and at least was able to register a request to have them consider marketing the minivan.
I would still buy one in a second if it were available....
This is an insanely frustrating experience and shows that people who claim "the market" will take care of everything are nuts! People are clamoring for efficient, low-polluting and somewhat roomy vehicles such as the Estima hybrid, and nothing is available!
The marketing people at Toyota are nuts. Most Camry buyers could use a Prius, but the Highlander is no alternative for the Sienna everyone should call 800-go-toyota (468-6982) requesting the Sienna hybrid (AWD 8 passenger) chances are they will wake up;-)
I am frustrated over the lack of vision of American automakers. Why don't they be the first at something and produce a hybrid van. I would buy one if I could get one. I don't see hybrids with big discounts to get them moving. Wake up GM!!
My wife and I recently (March-April, 2005) visit Japan as tourists and when we were in Tokyo we spotted an Estima minivan with a "hybrid" embossed chrome logo on the back. We stopped and talked to the business men standing near the van (who looked like corporate executives, judging from the quality of their suits).
At that time I had never heard of a hybrid mini-van, nor the Estima, but it was awesome. The gentleman told us it was a company car, it was full of executive luxury options (it had six independant lounger seats instead of any bench seats, and really large cup-holders and individual lights, cell phone charging plugs, and a shared video screen). It was amazing to look at and we wanted a more normal market one right away.
So far no one at our local Toyota dealer has been able to tell us much about our enquiry to "grey-market" import one for us, but they claim they are still researching it. It was a smidge smaller than the Siennas we see here in the states (eg: not useful for carrying 4x8' sheets of drywall/plywood), but plenty tall - I suspect the executive model we looked at may have been taller than a normal Estima, as it did not look normal.
I just want to add our voice to the clamoring for a hybrid minivan. All Toyota seems to be offering us in the US is the Highlander, which at 33mpg is not as fuel efficient as we want, plus doesn't have the seating we need (2 baby seats, plus older child, plus friends, plus cargo!). I will be calling the Toyota number listed earlier on this forum to register my demand for a hybrid minivan. Has anybody thought of a petition to Toyota? Since they are already producing these vehicles, it seems that with enough direct customer input they might be persuaded.
http://toyota.jp/Showroom/All_toyota_lineup/EstimaHybrid/index.html
Might be interesting to see this - even though it's all in Japanese.
I just called go toyota and the man I spoke with said that the hybrid mini-van will be released after the camry is released. The camry is set to release February 2006 and the mini-van has no release date but is in the line-up for right after the camry.
Did a google and found this article on Estima. Doesn't sound like it will be sold here anytime soon.
http://www.toyota.com/about/environment/technology/minivan.html
Add me to the list of those who would buy a hybrid minivan in a second if I could get my hands on one. The Highlander isn't what my family needs. What are they waiting for???
I followed up on the Estima link in Japanese and it showed the interworkings of this 4-wheel drive marvel.
http://toyota.jp/Showroom/All_toyota_lineup/EstimaHybrid/mechanism/index.html
The Estima uses a "parallel" hybrid gasoline engine with an electric motor/generator configuration to drive the front wheels and an electric motor to drive the rear wheels. If the electric motor and batteries were large enough, the van looks like it could be converted to a "plug-in" hybrid also. The plug-in gives you the option of charging the vehicle at night and running all-electric for the first 20 to 60 miles before switching to normal hybrid mode. The advatage of this is a 80-90% reduction in gasoline use.
Somebody tell TOYOTA that I'll put money down NOW for a hybrid minivan. I'm ready, when will they be?
The recent post about a hybrid that can run for short distances using an overnight electrical charge is very exciting. I can only hope that the delay in getting a hybrid Sienna on the market is related to adding features such as this and implementing the newest battery technologies.
A couple of folks here seem to think the Estima is the equivalent of the US Sienna. Actually the Estima is the vehicle sold overseas as the Previa but the new Previa (2000 onwards) was never sold in the US or Canada although it is available in lhd as it is sold in France. There are various engine and transmission options including a V6 and a diesel as well as the hybrid and 4wd is available on other engines, not just the hybrid's electric rear axle.
A few have escaped from their homeland (the hybrid has only ever been sold in Japan and hence is rhd only) and one was for sale in Jamaica recently.
Paul Norton - Toyota Estima Owners Club - http://www.estimaownersclub.com/community
For 2006 Honda will have an option for it's
V-6 (i-VTech) engines that employ "Variable Cylinder Technology" ie: shutting 3 of 6 cylinders off when cruising.
I have this on my '05 Accord Hybrid and only the
'economy' green light on the dash clues you to its operation!
Not a hybrid, but a help.
The iVTEC, which shuts down one bank of cylinders, ie, 3 out of 6 cylinders, is available beginning the redesigned (and already available) 2005 Odysseys. It is supposed to add 1mpg city and 3mpg highway.
couple more things. The iVTEC is only available on the top of the line Odyssey, so expect to pay some bucks for it.
also, a relevant article:
http://www.smartmoney.com/life/index.cfm?story=20050819-drive
Maybe this horrid increase in gas prices will push the market a bit more. I have been looking at minivans anyway, so I would trade my big a$$ SUV for a hybrid minivan NOW! I so regret getting it...sigh...
"Daihatsu Motor unveiled Monday a gasoline-electric version of its Hijet Cargo, touting it as the world's first hybrid minivan designed for commercial use."
http://www.mixedpower.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=759
The highlander shares an engine with the sienna some tech wiz should be able to tweak sienna into a hybrid with HH parts (or bribe you dealership service guy)
I am ready TODAY to trade in my wonderful Honday odyssey for a hybrid minivan...Toyota hurry up!
Our family, like so many of those noted above, is waiting for a quality hybrid van to be introduced here in Canada. We have a 1991 Corolla wagon -- and growing kids, and aging parents -- that we'd like to replace. Yet we also REFUSE to buy a newer high-polluting conventional van. Wake up, Toyota & Honda! How slow you are!
WANTED
hybrid minivan that comfortably seats 6-8
a/c, usb port, navigation
need asap
Add me to the list. Two adults, two kids, a dog and all my cargo would fit nicely in a new hybrid minivan. I told my wife that she could have the minivan when they came out with a hybrid. As much as I hate to admit it, I'd do it tomorrow if it were available.
Why don't the car companies get it? I've been waiting for over two years now hoping that someone will come out with a hybrid minivan. I refuse to buy anything until something becomes available. I URGE you to do the same--don't settle for less and don't purchase some behometh that gets crummy gas mileage, simply because it's easy to buy now rather than wait. If more of us wait, and simply don't buy, the pressure should be greater to come out with a hybrid minivan sooner.
I do hope that they will not use the hybrid function simply to boost power (yet again) and not strive for significantly greater fuel efficiency. Honda's Accord and the Toyota Highlander did this, and the additional MPG on each of these hybrids is not all that impressive. Automotive marketing and product development decisionmakers need to stop adhering to the outdated assumption that all Americans want the biggest, most powerful car that is possibly available.
It's not just about economics of better mileage (though this helps). It's about wanting to make a positive difference, personally, in my purchase decisions.
Craighton
Seattle
Why doesnt' the public get it. We've been crying for years for a hybrid minivan. Hell they have fuel cell technology thats ready and we wont see that when they say either.
Soaring gas prices wont drive the market to hybrid it will do the opposite.
I'm as frustrated as anyone else but the truth is, anything that will cut on oil and petroleum sales like a sienna hybrid (which will be 1 in 10 cars on the road after a few years) gets the rights bought out by the oil companies. Its collusion! And we are getting the bad end of the deal.
It doesn't matter how much we cry, the automakers develop and hype these products so they can get more money from the oil companies when they sell the design.
I'd love a hybrid minivan, but this high-tech wizardry isn't necessary to get better mileage. If they'd just offer a basic 4-cylinder engine, like on Accord and Camry, you'd jump 5-10 mpg. Within the past 15 years, automakers stopped offering four bangers, because power-hungry Americans weren't buying them.
>>If they'd just offer a basic 4-cylinder engine, like on Accord and Camry, you'd jump 5-10 mpg.
Good point. And that's why they have Diesel minivans in Europe... my cousin in France has one... I'll bet they get much better mpg...
Come on big three!!! Where is your common sense? There is a massive market waiting for you to come out with a hybrid minivan?
Whoever has been in email contact with Toyota - please send this entire list to them ASAP.
Ive been waiting for an Alphard since gas was 1.60/gallon.
MSRP is going to be 35k for the 1st people I'll bet - but competition will bring it down if the koreans and chinese bring their own out.
Jon March in Connecticut
Joining the list of those anxious for a hybrid mini-van! I practically live in my van. With four kids, I am constantly driving. With gas prices going up maybe car manufacturers will finally get a grip and give us Mini-van drivers a break.
Don't they realize that people who drive minivans spend a lot of time on the road and are also the future car buyers for the next generation as well!!
I just want a hybrid that will fit 6 people comfortably...
Me too. The only reason I'm holding back on the van for my family of 5 is because there is no hybrid van. I need a hybrid van even if I have to pay $10k more.
I see a whole lot of talk in this thread about how interested we all are in buying a hybrid mini-van, but what I see lacking is feedback from the automakers, especially Honda, who we know sells the Estima Hybrid internationally. Has anyone contacted Honda and gotten their reason for not selling them in the US? I am about to write Honda and will be sure to post the feedback I get. Honda is a very good company and there has to be a very solid reason they chose not to sell Hybrid in the US. Pure speculation here, but suspect they have done market research and it shows there is not enough interest, or possible the US Government is doing something to discourage import.
Anyway, I am done talking and am ready to take action!! I will be back with feedback !
I live in western Canada where the price of gas keeps creeping up.I will wait for the hybrid minivan, it is the only woth while purshase for my family of six.Its hard to wait when you know that the technology is out there,but not in your market place.
Toyota and Honda,one of you step up to the plate and set the standard for hybrid minivans.
i called that number, 800-go-toyota (468-6982), and got an add for a 900 pay number!
what's the deal?
I would buy one too, like many of you. I was actually ready for a hybrid minivan over a year ago ...
Technologically, there should be NO problem, as Toyota proved it with its hybrid minivans for year.
It is extremely strange that there is still NO such offering in North America. What are they hiding?
well, I put my $ where my mouth was, and I've bought an estima off the Japanese auction, should be here in NZ in about 4 weeks or so. Hope it goes :) I can't wait to play with it!
Harry machiela
Napier
NZ
Well just like the readers of this thread, I've read a lot about hybrids in the last month or two. Word is that hybrids make up about 2% of US sales, and most of the automakers (US and Japan) see the US hybrid market as a test market, so they aren't shipping many cars here. That keeps sales suppressed, making the condition cyclic.
Basically I think that we will be in this state until we and our neighbors all drive hybrids. The fools buying up HumV's are polluting the American marketing data. On my suburban street there are two HumV's and not a hybrid in sight.
Dan <11011011> - http://screamingmonkeys.blogspot.com
I would only buy one if it were a large minivan. Most minivans are too small for me. I drive a VW Eurovan. I'm looking forward to the 2007/2008 update for the Eurovan. The last year VW made vans was in 2003. I really have no options to purchase another van the same size as mine unless I go with a full size van, which to me have a commercial drive feel and a contractor look. Price isn't an option. If I could import the Alphard Hybrid then I would if I could keep the warranty, but that isn't an option. I believe BMW or Mercedes is coming out with a large minivan in 2007 or 08. I usually buy a new van every 3 years, usually VWs, but now I have no options. Toyota, Honda and the rest are too small and those that are bigger look like I just got off a job site. A hybrid van would be ideal. I spend entirely too much time at the pump. I don't mind paying for the gas, but it would be nice to not have to visit the pump so often. Personally, I don't really care about the environment, but I would pay about $10k more for a hybrid for the sake of having battery banks and not having to visit the pumps as often. I get around 17-21 mpg depending on where I am driving. Another issue, is I have no idea how safe my van is because the nhtsa nor the european organization has not tested the vehicle. That is another issue, but all the minivans are just too mini for me. So I couldn't buy this Sienna hybrid thing, but if you came out with that Toyota Alphard Hybrid even for $55k, then I'd get it in a heart beat. But they won't bring a van that expensive, nobody has, because vans are for soccer moms who are supposedly frugile. The MicroBus was going to be great, but they decided to not do that either. Nobody wants to take a risk in the auto industry when it comes to vans. To me they are all the same. I do like the Honda Odessey, but it is too small. The tire/wheel safety feature is nice. I have had some tire blow outs and it's scary. The cylinder shut off is neat, but I would prefer a hybrid specifically for the 110volt battery bank. The only van that looks remotely to mine is that new Dodge International with the mercedes engine, but I then look like a ups vehicle. I may end up going that route. I'm not sure I can deal with waiting for a new vehicle in 2008. I might be able to hold off for another year and a half, but I need a new van every few years. There's not much out there other than tiny minivans.
I work for a honda dealership. At this time there is no solid committment for a hybrid van however it is under consideration for 2008-2009.
Part of the reason you do not see more hybrid is because honda corp just doesn't make much money on them and they are still somewhat unproven for service history in any large numbers. After 5 years or so of service data I think they will have more of a comfort level.
I was interested by the September 07 post about the Sienna sharing an engine with the Highlander. Sounds like a business opportunity for someone to convert some Siennas. I'd pay for one, and I have a friend who would, too. I have similar thoughts as many other posts. I have 3 kids who are getting big, and I need to cart them around along with friends, gear, etc. There are just not good choices if you need a vehicle with a capacity of 7-8 people. If anyone can find someone who can do a convert, count me in!
Follow up on my Sept 28th posting (see above string) .....
I advised I was writitng Honda and Toyota about the precived demand for Hybrid Minivans. Got a call from Honda saying they have no plans, but thanks for writting, they will share my thoughts with those that should hear it within Honda.
I have not heard back from the Toyota folks
Larry, (Oct 12),
If Toyota's not answering thier phone, try email. Here's thier email form, and I usually get a reply. http://toyota.custhelp.com
Can't find the Honda email form. Could someone post?
Dan <11011011> - http://screamingmonkeys.blogspot.com
Dan (and others)
I finally heard back from Toyota. The guy that called me sounded like he was reading from a script - thanks...will make sure your suggestion is reviewed by management...other models are being added each year...blah blah blah. I asked him if they had received similar feedback from others and he could not tell me. I asked how far out Toyota plans new releases..again he could not tell me.
I actually wrote letters and faxed them to Honda and Toyota. The numbers are on their web sites
Ah, corporations. Didn't you see the movie? They're all psychopathic.
We need another "Tucker" on this one. A renegade with a vision.
I'm married with two small kids. We've already outgrown the '97 Volvo 850 wagon we drive, since every time we have to take another adult or child passenger along with us, we're compromising safety as well as comfort.
I'm desperately passionate about the cause of reducing fuel consumption... for years, North American car ads with their focus on "power" and "climbing mountains" have made me sick with frustration.
WOMEN AND SENSIBLE MEN DO BUY VEHICLES. I wish this message could get through to those who manufacture automobiles.
We're lucky to live in a city with decent walkability, bikeability, and public transport, but we do need to own a car.
I WANT A HYBRID MINIVAN THAT SEATS 6+, DAMNIT!!!! AND I DON'T CARE HOW "POWERFUL" IT IS! I JUST WANT IT TO GET ME FROM HERE TO THERE SAFELY!!!
LISTEN TO ME!!! I HAVE THE MONEY RIGHT HERE AND I AM NOT SPENDING IT! GIVE ME THE CAR I WANT TO BUY!!!!
Thank you for giving me an outlet.
I have been waiting for the Estima since 2001. In the meantime we purchased a Honda Civic sedan. Recently we rented a minivan to take a trip to the Black Hills, a fun experience for us and our two boys. That trip, however, convinced me I don't need a minivan, I can rent one for those few times that a minivan is necessary. (We only have two boys, if we had more children I'd definitely opt for the minivan.) So, we're planning on buying a Prius next year. But, I'm heartened by all of the comments here.
"The Hybrid dreamers, watch out".
The hybrid cars currently on the market cost from $3500 to $6000 more per car than comparable cars with conventional gas engines. This means that the amount of money you save, or don’t save, by buying a hybrid is very much dependent on gasoline prices. If gas is priced at $2.00 per gallon (we wish), it could take the average driver (15,000 miles per year) between 10 and 15 years to amortize the $3500 increase in the initial price. However, the higher gas prices go, the less time it takes to recoup the higher price tag.
FWIW: I emailed Toyota and got a response (pretty quickly, actually). The response was "We apologize, we do not currently have any plans to announce the introduction of a hybrid Sienna Minivan in the U.S. We are, however, aware of consumer interest, and consistently strive to remain competitive in today's market...."
They thanked me for my interest and documented it in the National Headquarters (I'm sure I know what that means).
Remesh,
thanks for your input, bu most people can figure out whether the economics of the hybrid work out for their particular situation. Unfortunately, folks like you and Consumer Reports propogate the myth that the hybrid drive train is not worth the cost based on the "average driver". You may want to look at the September Money Magazine article on the actual cost SAVINGS from driving hybrids and diesels. In addition, I would suspect most folks that chose to be hybrid drivers are not average or they do so for reasons other that pure economics. I do chose to drive a hybrid to save money. I drive over 25,000 miles per year, often 30,000. Also, the $3,500-6,000 you cite as additional cost is not entirely accurate when compared to comparably equipped models. Furthermore, when the federal AND state tax incentives are accounted for, there often is much less of a difference in cost. In Connecticut (where I live), they allow purchasers of hybrids to skip the state sales tax of 6%! That, along with the federal deductions/credits goes a long way toward covering the up-front cost difference.
I would also like a hybrid minivan, I am so tired of the horible gas milage my SUV gets and my kids are only getting bigger. I need more room. If they had a hybrid minivan on the market I would buy it tomorrow.
To the guy from NYC who needs a large van,
Your prayer is answer!
Mercedes is testing a PLUG-IN DIESEL HYBRID sprinter, I think that model comes inboth high top and reg top too.
Yeah...you guys love HEVs, check this out - whos pulling the wool now - maybe Toyota! IT IS REAL - check the Detroit News and free press!
Ad attacks Toyota's record
Environmental group questions efficiency
October 24, 2005
BY SARAH A. WEBSTER
FREE PRESS BUSINESS WRITER
"Is Toyota a wolf in sheep's clothing?"
That's what a stinging national ad campaign against Toyota Motor Corp., launched today by a San
Francisco-based environmental group, suggests. The ad is to run in Mother Jones online today and
be printed soon in full-page ads in the New York Times and other publications.
Created by the Bluewater Network, a nonprofit organization that fights for clean air and water,
the ads against Toyota are thought to be the first ever to attack a Japanese automaker on its
environmental record in the United States.
Bluewater says Toyota's hybrids aren't as efficient as their non-hybrid versions and questions why
the automaker is fighting tougher standards on fuel economy and emissions. They also note that
while Toyota's overall fuel economy is the best in the industry, it is worse than it was 20 years
ago, according to the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency.
Toyota spokeswoman Nancy Hubbell said the automaker is disappointed by the campaign.
"Toyota is definitely the environmental leader, and we're extremely surprised," she said.
Bluewater is the same environmental group that launched a personal ad campaign against Ford Motor
Co. last year, portraying Ford Chairman and Chief Executive Officer Bill Ford as Pinocchio and
challenging the automaker's record on environmental issues.
Those ads, according to Bluewater, were largely a consequence of Ford portraying himself as an
environmentalist, making promises and not keeping them.
Now, Bluewater is taking on Toyota.
"We don't enjoy playing the truth squad," Danielle Fugere, director of climate change at
Bluewater, said. "But when the auto industry misleads the public, whether intentionally or not,
someone's got to set the record straight."
The ads against Toyota are likely to be heralded by Detroit automakers, which have been crying
foul for years now over Toyota's seemingly bulletproof image with consumers as the environmentally
friendly automaker.
Toyota makes one-third of the hybrid gasoline-electric vehicles sold in the United States and has
consequently benefited from Earth-friendly buzz -- even getting A-list celebrities to arrive at
the Academy Awards in hybrid Prius compact cars as an environmentally conscious fashion statement.
But Bluewater's ads, which were obtained by the Free Press last week, show Toyota CEO Katsuaki
Watanabe in the foreground and a man wearing a wolf head in the background. The ads list a series
of concerns about Toyota.
Foremost, the group questions why Toyota's newest hybrids don't get much better fuel economy than
their non-hybrid versions.
The hybrid version of the Highlander got only 20.6 miles per gallon in a week-long test drive this
year on a range of driving conditions by Free Press auto critic Mark Phelan. The EPA rating shows
the vehicle gets 33 m.p.g. city/28 m.p.g. highway in federal tests. The non-hybrid Highlander,
meanwhile, was rated 19 m.p.g. city/25 m.p.g. highway by the EPA -- much closer to the actual
results in the hybrid.
Other journalists have found similar results, Bluewater notes in its ad, calling the Highlander
and Lexus RX 400h "gas guzzlers with no better fuel economy than their non-hybrid versions."
"If this is the precedent for Toyota's future hybrids, that will be bad news for global warming
and our dependence on foreign oil," the ad says.
Hubbell of Toyota defended the company's hybrid vehicles, saying they are more efficient than
their gasoline counterparts. What's more, she said they are 80% cleaner in emissions.
Bluewater also asks why Toyota is working with other automakers to resist federal efforts to raise
national fuel mileage standards and suing to block California's proposed regulations to reduce
smog and greenhouse gas pollution.
Hubbell said Toyota is lobbying for regulations that are "rational and national," to avoid a
patchwork system of standards "that would be a nightmare" to comply with for manufacturers.
The ads also note that the average fuel mileage of Toyota vehicles is worse today than it was 20
years ago, according to the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency's 2005 Fuel Economy Trends
report. In 2005, Toyota's fleet averaged 27.5 miles per gallon, the highest among manufacturers.
But the company performed better in 1985, with its fleet averaging 30.0 miles per gallon, the EPA
report shows.
While Toyota has a stable of fuel-efficient cars, including the hybrid Prius, it also makes the
Land Cruiser SUV (17 m.p.g. on the highway); Sequoia SUV (18 m.p.g.); 4Runner SUV (21 m.p.g.), and
Tundra Double Cab (18 m.p.g.). Those vehicles have helped lower Toyota's overall fuel economy.
"Toyota has a lot of explaining to do," Bluewater's ads say. "We thought Toyota cared about the
environment. ... Is this the same company that brought us the hybrid Prius, claiming to be an
environmental leader?"
The ads provide Toyota's telephone number and encourage consumers to call and ask Toyota to "build
more fuel-efficient cars and end Toyota's opposition to critical U.S. environmental policies."
Contact SARAH A. WEBSTER at 313-222-5394 or .
FEEL SHEEPISH NOW - WHOS LEADING THE BLIND!
before you go jumping off the bridge to "HEVs", read this..
Ad attacks Toyota's record
Environmental group questions efficiency
October 24, 2005
BY SARAH A. WEBSTER
FREE PRESS BUSINESS WRITER
"Is Toyota a wolf in sheep's clothing?"
That's what a stinging national ad campaign against Toyota Motor Corp., launched today by a San
Francisco-based environmental group, suggests. The ad is to run in Mother Jones online today and
be printed soon in full-page ads in the New York Times and other publications.
Created by the Bluewater Network, a nonprofit organization that fights for clean air and water,
the ads against Toyota are thought to be the first ever to attack a Japanese automaker on its
environmental record in the United States.
Bluewater says Toyota's hybrids aren't as efficient as their non-hybrid versions and questions why
the automaker is fighting tougher standards on fuel economy and emissions. They also note that
while Toyota's overall fuel economy is the best in the industry, it is worse than it was 20 years
ago, according to the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency.
Toyota spokeswoman Nancy Hubbell said the automaker is disappointed by the campaign.
"Toyota is definitely the environmental leader, and we're extremely surprised," she said.
Bluewater is the same environmental group that launched a personal ad campaign against Ford Motor
Co. last year, portraying Ford Chairman and Chief Executive Officer Bill Ford as Pinocchio and
challenging the automaker's record on environmental issues.
Those ads, according to Bluewater, were largely a consequence of Ford portraying himself as an
environmentalist, making promises and not keeping them.
Now, Bluewater is taking on Toyota.
"We don't enjoy playing the truth squad," Danielle Fugere, director of climate change at
Bluewater, said. "But when the auto industry misleads the public, whether intentionally or not,
someone's got to set the record straight."
The ads against Toyota are likely to be heralded by Detroit automakers, which have been crying
foul for years now over Toyota's seemingly bulletproof image with consumers as the environmentally
friendly automaker.
Toyota makes one-third of the hybrid gasoline-electric vehicles sold in the United States and has
consequently benefited from Earth-friendly buzz -- even getting A-list celebrities to arrive at
the Academy Awards in hybrid Prius compact cars as an environmentally conscious fashion statement.
But Bluewater's ads, which were obtained by the Free Press last week, show Toyota CEO Katsuaki
Watanabe in the foreground and a man wearing a wolf head in the background. The ads list a series
of concerns about Toyota.
Foremost, the group questions why Toyota's newest hybrids don't get much better fuel economy than
their non-hybrid versions.
The hybrid version of the Highlander got only 20.6 miles per gallon in a week-long test drive this
year on a range of driving conditions by Free Press auto critic Mark Phelan. The EPA rating shows
the vehicle gets 33 m.p.g. city/28 m.p.g. highway in federal tests. The non-hybrid Highlander,
meanwhile, was rated 19 m.p.g. city/25 m.p.g. highway by the EPA -- much closer to the actual
results in the hybrid.
Other journalists have found similar results, Bluewater notes in its ad, calling the Highlander
and Lexus RX 400h "gas guzzlers with no better fuel economy than their non-hybrid versions."
"If this is the precedent for Toyota's future hybrids, that will be bad news for global warming
and our dependence on foreign oil," the ad says.
Hubbell of Toyota defended the company's hybrid vehicles, saying they are more efficient than
their gasoline counterparts. What's more, she said they are 80% cleaner in emissions.
Bluewater also asks why Toyota is working with other automakers to resist federal efforts to raise
national fuel mileage standards and suing to block California's proposed regulations to reduce
smog and greenhouse gas pollution.
Hubbell said Toyota is lobbying for regulations that are "rational and national," to avoid a
patchwork system of standards "that would be a nightmare" to comply with for manufacturers.
The ads also note that the average fuel mileage of Toyota vehicles is worse today than it was 20
years ago, according to the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency's 2005 Fuel Economy Trends
report. In 2005, Toyota's fleet averaged 27.5 miles per gallon, the highest among manufacturers.
But the company performed better in 1985, with its fleet averaging 30.0 miles per gallon, the EPA
report shows.
While Toyota has a stable of fuel-efficient cars, including the hybrid Prius, it also makes the
Land Cruiser SUV (17 m.p.g. on the highway); Sequoia SUV (18 m.p.g.); 4Runner SUV (21 m.p.g.), and
Tundra Double Cab (18 m.p.g.). Those vehicles have helped lower Toyota's overall fuel economy.
"Toyota has a lot of explaining to do," Bluewater's ads say. "We thought Toyota cared about the
environment. ... Is this the same company that brought us the hybrid Prius, claiming to be an
environmental leader?"
The ads provide Toyota's telephone number and encourage consumers to call and ask Toyota to "build
more fuel-efficient cars and end Toyota's opposition to critical U.S. environmental policies."
Contact SARAH A. WEBSTER at 313-222-5394 or .
Dave, if you beleive this so called "expert" your in trouble. Lets face it, when it comes to SUV's, Toyota is no diffrent them anyone else - to move a big old ark of a vehicle is going to take a lot of gas and produce a lot of emmissions. This is what americans like, so Toyota would be foolish not to make SUV's. However, in all honesty this article is nothing more then a personal vendetta against Toyota for having the brains to ALSO make fuel efficiant vehicles. Ms Fix has an outlet for her views, and she is using that for her personal biased attack. If your going to attach anyone, attack the automakers that don't make Hybrids and are making little to no effort to save the environment.
Wow! talk about a biased article. I'm not opposed to slamming Toyota, in fact, I participated in a slap down when they started crushing the few RAV4EV's, however, this is total garbage.
They compare their 'week-long test drive' results of the Highlander Hybrid with the EPA for the non-hybrid but they don't look at how the non-hybrid Highlander compares with either it's EPA or a similiar 'week-long test drive'. They also slam Toyota's 2005 avg fuel economy with their 1985 economy without looking at any other manufacturer's similiar comparison.
I admit that the Highlander hybrid is built for power, more than economy but this is ridiculous. I wonder if their week-long test driver remembered to release the emergency brake. Must have been the same clod that did Consumer Reports' hybrid test drives.
There are clearly may other silly non-comparisons that I certainly hope people can see through.
Just to keep everyones hopes up. My google alerts have been going balistic over the Toyota Hybrid Minivan showcased in the Tokyo Motor Show.
Long link: http://car-reviews.automobile.com/news/toyota-at-tokyo-six-radical-new-concepts/1482/
Tiny Link: http://tinyurl.com/dbxy8
or just google "(sienna OR odessey OR minivan OR estima OR previa) hybrid"
Dan <11011011> http://ScreamingMonkeys.blogspot.com
Toyota has a survey online asking what kind of vehicle people want 'hybridized' next. Here's a chance to provide direct feedback to Toyota if you want a hybrid Sienna (or any other vehicle style for that matter).
http://www.toyota.com/hybridsynergyview/2005/fall/viewemail.html
Thanks for pointing me to the survey on Toyota's website. I voted. Like everyone else, I would buy a hybrid van in an instant. I have four kids and was down right upset to see the Highlander Hybrid. Is there really more market for that monster over a Sienna Hybrid? While I'm upset that there isn't a hybrid option out there, I'm glad that the Odessey has decent gas mileage with the VTEC engine and could possibly see myself going this route if there's nothing on the horizon with Toyota. My current van is 8 years old and won't last reliably for more that about three more years... I'll hold out as long as I can, though.
I'm betting on the Seinna Hybrid in 2008! Toyota has prototypes of it's new hybrid synergy drive working. It's getting folded into thier hybrid models in 2008. I'd expect a LOT of Toyota/Lexus models to go Hybrid on this tansition.
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/10067373/
Works for me 2008/2009 is about when our Odyssey will be maxed out and it's note paid in full.
-Dan <11011011> http://ScreamingMonkeys.blogspot.com
Thumbs down Toyota for not bringing the Estima hybrid to US markets. I would buy one today if one were available. Why do we have to wait for the "larger" less fuel efficient Sienna hybrid when they already have a proven hybrid minivan available in Japan? I have heard nothing but rave reviews of this vehicle and would love to at least have the opportunity to test drive one. Come on Toyota we all don’t need or want larger and more powerful cars. That’s just the American car companies making those decisions for me and I’m getting tired of the same old message.
The Japanese mini-van probably does not meet the crash requirements. Does it make sense not to re-invent the wheel unless the wheel doesn't work?
I'd buy a hybrid minivan today. In fact, I'm holding off on buying one for now just because I want a hybrid. I can't wait forever.
I, like many others, are putting off a new purchase of a minivan until a hybrid comes out. Even then I would buy in the second year of production so the bugs are worked out.
Have two Toyotas now, Avalon and Lexus RX300, with a little over 100K in miles, so I have another 100K of miles that I can wait till the hybrid minivans come out.
My mom was just in France and rented a VW Touran diesel seated eight people I think she said. if not eight than 7. I drive 2004 jetta tdi myself. I think a diesel minvan would sell well here.
Me too. Hybrid minivan right NOW. Any automakers listening??
> I think a diesel minvan would sell well here.
I agree. My cousin in France has a diesel minivan. It looked really nice. I think it would sell too.
I have just received my Estima Hybrid minivan in Napier, New Zealand, where I live. I had to import it privately from Japan, but no problems. Not sure yet if the fuel economy is as good as claimed, but I do live on a hill, so that ruins it a bit :)
Very very luxurious though, I'm loving learning to drive it too!
Good luck getting them in the USA ):
The reason they are not sold here is due to trade agreements and restrictions imposed by the US government. It would certainly outsell all us minivans and if you check recent news, Toyota, agreed to raise its price for all vehicles, to help US makers stay in business. What a sad state of affairs for US automakers.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8170340
What ever happend to the free market and market driven innovation?
Here is a good source of information about gas, diesel, or hybrids at UK's Vehicle Certification Agency:
http://www.vcacarfueldata.org.uk/search/
This data can be sorted by: make/model/specification; fuel economy (Imperial/metric); and fuel type (petrol/diesel/LPG-CNG/petrol-hybrid).
Do not forget the UK uses Imperial Gallon @ approximately 1.2 gallons(US).
I can't wait to buy a hybrid minivan. Either Toyota or Honda will do. I am banking on one of them coming out with a hybrid minivan by the time our second kid is born in a couple of years. Rolling the dice... come on snake eyes!!!
I would buy a hybrid minivan today if it was available, our third child is on the way and I really wanted our next car to be a hybrid, but what will fit our needs?
TOYOTA SIENNA Minivan needs and wants:
Needs -
Toyota needs to configure the Highlander/Lexus RX400h/Camry hybrid system into the Sienna and retain the folding third row seat. Is this possible with current battery packs?
Toyota ABSOLUTELY needs to cure the " no spare tire " run-flat tire problem. As you know, consumers far and near lament purchasing the XLE LIMITED AWD version as the run-flat tires it comes with last 10-15,000 miles and cost twice what a standard tire does to replace!
Wants -
Drove a Highlander hybrid with all options recently - fantastic vehicle, too small for family guys' needs like mine. I noticed no keyless entry option such as the Prius', wherein the key remains in your pocket or purse and the door unlocks automatically. Also, the new Sienna should include a push button start, such as the Prius. The Highlander Hybrid has a standard key and ignition, and it is located awkwardly where you need to reach around the steering column such as in my Toyota truck.
A voice-activated nav system with XM capability and real-time traffic option is needed too, such as is available on the Honda Odyssey. A larger nav screen as in the Honda would be a smart ugrade as well. Bluetooth is available on today's Sienna nav package and the hand's free phone is a great addition. Tech that can voice operate the complex sound system and even the 3 zone climate control would be very smart. Anything that keeps your eyes on the road ahead and off the complicated switchgear, or your mobile phone will save lives.
More HP in the Hybrid Sienna will be a welcome improvement. The standard AWD Limited Sienna is noticeably more sluggish from a stop and up hills vs. the non AWD models.
Please step up the next gen hybrids wherein they can be plugged in and slow charged overnight to increase mileage greatly.Kits are available now to retrofit Priuses with this capability but they void Toyota's factory warranty
I nearly purchased the XLE Limited Sienna with all the bells and whistles in December. My wife and I decided we'll wait for the Sienna hybrid no matter how long it takes. It is a sacrifice since our kids' needs are increasing and a minivan is a must.Toyota is keeping it's release date more hush than the Colonel's secret recipe at KFC! - Marketing - Wouldn't you if you had tens of thousands of non - hybrid Siennas on the lot to sell?! We're not " tree huggers" but are not blind to global warming. Emissions improvements take a second seat to our main priority - too lesson our nation's need for fossil fuels ( 2/3 of the Earth's supply owned by countrys that consider us " infidels " not worthy of breathing ). Let's band together and do what we can to detach ourselves from these dependencies. Iran announced recently it's desire to jack up oil prices incredibly unless we allow them to build their nukes. Hydrogen technology is far off, and the plants it'll take to produce adequate hydrogen will be natural gas propelled, so the end result is not one as rosey as some have proclaimed. So far, the latest hybrid technology is the best we have to date.
I was wondering if maybe even Ford could be looking at a hybrid minivan - maybe it would revitalize their sales. Disappointed to read that they instead seem to be dropping out of the minivan market. Sounds like big, inefficient crossovers are now the big thing. http://www.theautochannel.com/news/2006/01/20/207977.html
They used to be innovative. I am not too old to remember.
Our Dodge caravan is getting old -- but we'll hang on to it until we can get something with better fuel economy. I see lots of frustration here with Toyota, but what about the Korean makers -- or any of the aggressive companies.
By the way -- I love my Honda Civic hybrid. If the fuel gauge is to be believed, I'm averaging 52 mpg after 3 years.
These auto makers are so not smart. WE WANT A HYBRID MINI-VAN!!! I love the Prius, but it's for old folks. C'mon boys, give it up for families! Who do you think wants to save money more; convertible owners or mommies?
I think that the choke-hold the oil companies have on the U.S. is pretty evident in the fact that there aren't more hybrids available. Put my family of 6 on the list of buyers as soon as a hybrid minivan comes out... If the US auto makers are listening... Use the Honda Odyssey for your role model! Now that's an awesome minivan!!!
I'm impressed...and somewhat bemused...by the posts on this link. Yes, a hybrid mini-van would be good, on some levels...but does it need all the "bells and whistles," as some have seemed to suggest? I.e., if a Preston Tucker-type did come out with a basic model hybrid minivan = roll-up windows, am-fm radio, no 'navigation' anything, and etc. = would everybody still be so quick to jump to the line? And if the Model T approach then followed - the same basic model for several years - would people still be as excited?
For what it's worth, my '91 Ford Aerostar, with 230,000 miles, still gets @25 mpg on the freeway. If we all kept our tires at the right inflation, changed the oil ourselves at semi-regular intervals, and, oh yes, drove at a constant 55 or 62 1/2 mph, we'd all save lots of $$ and gas, no matter what vehicle we drove. Sometimes it's the obvious things that we miss...
Peace to all.
It's obvious to me that there is demand for a hybrid minivan in the U.S. I look around at the vast numbers of Toyota Siennas and Honda Odysseys on the road, and minivans are appealing to families as a fuel-saving alternative to SUVs. We have enjoyed our 2 year old Honda Odyssey after driving SUVs and we're waiting anxiously for a hybrid now. I emailed Toyota and the response was that they "have no current plans to announce the introduction of a hybrid Sienna in the U.S." I hope that "no current plans to announce" means that it's on the drawing board and they don't want to tell us. I find that Toyota and Honda a very tight-lipped about their plans. I suppose if everyone knew there would be a hybrid Sienna, nobody would buy their current one! I think we're going to have to wait it out, folks!
Add me to the list of people who would buy a hybrid minivan today if it were available. I just traded in my X5 for the Rx400h and I am very impressed. The car drives like a dream and watching the consumption screen has changed my driving habits to driving slower, more coasting and smoothers starts and stops. I am tempted to buy another one to replace my 2002 Odyssey but I want AWD (in the NE) and hybrid and the space to load our bikes, dogs, and camping gear in the vehicle. No way i could fit all that in the 400h and it is too nice a car anyway for the dirty gear after a weekend of camping or sailing to be flung in the bag, not to mention a couple of wet dogs! A minivan is a different story. So I second all those clamouring for an AWD hybrid minivan. Great post James, your suggestions are spot on!
Another me too for this list.
Even though it may or may not make financial sense to buy a hybrid I want one so that I can do *something* to decrease our reliance on foreign oil.
if the vans arocking - don't come knocking !
A Hybrid or diesel minivan would be nice. i believe that there is a market for viechles that get better mpg.
and me to the list for a hybrid minvan--but it wont happen tomorrow sadly. I refuse to BUY anything from the BIG three. yeah, I know they WILL go bankrupt before I do and thats WHOSE fault? they had their chance 20 years ago before their collusion with BIG OIL.
they had their chance to do us all right and the environment and didnt, instead chose collusion with BIG OIL and politicos. they got their profits making BIG ol' SUVs for so long, you can stick a fork in it if Getty is right is right and gas hits 5 dollars a gallon.
does anyone see where this is going? we have all frustratedly waited for over a decade and still nothing has happened. Car companies have limped to the finish line with a crappy product and promises. Maybe the oil companies will buy the car companies, they fed the monster, now live with it forever.
Our family requirements are for a hybrid minivan with 4WD. Why can't Toyota or Honda deliver what the market wants? We've given up on Detroit. I just noted that a company called Energy Conversion Devices in Ohio has just announced in California that they have perfected the technology for a Hydrogen hydrate Prius that has a 200 mile range. You go the the hydrogen station and have this hydrogen powder put into your gas tank. The car uses electricity to heat a small poriton of it to convert it into hydrogen gas which is then burned in the engine. You have no bulky hydrogen tanks on the car.
I've looked through all these questions that people are asking, why not a hybrid minivan? I have long wondered this myself, why has the industry not realized the advantage of the so called "minivan" versus car, thruck and the other types of transportation that they offer. I've used nothing but a minivan for ten years and would consider nothing else. I can haul material in it if needed and it has good seating capacity, a car truck combination in my opinion. To have a hybrid minvan would be a BIG plus but I suppose that it will be offered by some other manufacturer other than our own. WHY???? Are our CEO's and his officers too busy counting their money to get involved with common sense? Are they more interested in selling oil along with our govenment? That's what it looks like from here. The "grant" monies offered for research are peanuts in respect to what we give to Haliburton in one day. NUTS.
I wonder if instead of (or until) a hybrid minivan, Toyota might consider following Honda's lead and put the cylinder shut-down technology that Honda has in the Odyssey. Drop from 6 to 3 cylinders when not needed (like cruising on the hwy). Does anyone have that level trim Odyssey that they can talk to re: it's mileage?
I am waiting for the hybrid minivan, too. I don't need a big one. The size of 98 sienna is good for us. So, if possible, I would like to import the current Japanese version of 4wd hypbrid. Am I allow to import one? My 98 sienna has almost 100,000 miles on it. It is still running like new. The engine and transmission are smooth and quiet like new. The gas-milage is around 17 mile per gallon mostly city drive (22-26 when new). But we need a all wheel minivan!!! I am attracted to the FJ Crusier. However, the gas milage is poor on a SUV in general to begin with... then, it gets worse later.
If any way, I could import one hybrid minivan with all wheel drive from Japan?
I just spoke with Carson Toyota rep whose webpage speaks about the Estima and another possible Toyota hybrid minivan - she says they are smaller than the Sienna, and don't have much power -- they are not planning on release of a hybrid minivan any time soon - several years away still. I am on the verge of getting the 4wd hybrid highlander w/ 3rd row seating, but it is in no way as comfortable as a minivan - getting in the 3rd row seat is very awkward.
I think the auto industry is way behind the ball on this. All the parents with young families I know want a hybrid minivan.
I have to agree with a previous commenter that part of the problem is America's lust for power, as it were. I just don't really need 250+hp in my minivan. I don't need a minivan that sprints from 0-60 in 8 seconds (this is what my 1993 MR2 Turbo - which still gets an avg of 25mpg - is for). Maybe one day, I'll be hauling around 6 200lb men and pining for more power, but until that day, I'd be just as content to drive a less powerful, more fuel efficient minivan. If it's a hybrid that pollutes less, all the better.
Hybrid minivans have "fleet sales" written all over them. Can you imagine the fuel savings in NYC rush hour traffic?
You can order directly from japan
The Toyota Alphard Hybrid Van:
http://www.batfa.com/new_car_toyota_alphard_hybrid.htm
It is right hand drive though.
Can someone tell me where this website gets the information in the "Cars" section? I have googled as well as searched the Toyota website and see absolutely nothing about a Sienna hybrid in the works. Only on this site.
Our Honda Accord is 8 years old - I figure if I start planning now, PERHAP we can afford one in 2 years.
I'm not into car payments, and can't for the life of me figure out who is able to afford cars approaching 40K! But I figure as every year passes, fuel will only be going up.
Anyway, about the Sienna - where is that info coming from?
We need a minivan now. (Three growing kids and the backseat of the Explorer is getting small.) We've decided we are going to lease an Odessy or Quest hoping that by the time the lease ends there will be a hybrid minivan on the market. With gasoline quickly approaching $3 per gallon its making more and more sense.
Too bad the short sighted Detroit automakers and D.C. politicians still don't realize (or are so slow in realizing) that a Hummer or Suburban isn't the answer for the average American family.
2006 and no hybrid minivan insight!
I have a two cars from the early 90s and desperately want a hybrid minivan for my growing family. I put 100 miles on my car every day!
Willing to wait for a hybrid minivan and let my two existing cars fall apart on the road. Hope its soon...
I am a single guy, not one to buy a mini-van or a hybrid, for that matter. I am just a car enthusiat and I check-out cars for fun.
For work, I spent most of my time in Asia between Japan, Singapore, Thailand, and Hong Kong. In Asia, that Toyota Alphard is everywhere and caught my eye a long time ago. Let me tell you, the Alphard Hybrid is a beauty. It's definitely bigger than the Sienna. I think it's about right-sized for the American market. It's also ultra-luxurious (I'm talking Lexus class). For the life of me I cannot understand why Toyota has so far made no plans to export it to the USA. I am sure many in the US would snatch it up.
The only reason I can think of is maybe if Toyota sells the Alphard in US, GM and Ford will be left in the dust. Maybe this will bring Congress into a wave of protectionism.
Why can't GM and Ford just make better cars and lead with technology???
I would love a Hybrid Minivan. I went from a Sienna to a Prius to save on my gas bill. I was driving 90 miles a day. I love the Prius and the gas savings. However I really really really miss the size and space of my minivan and have considered trading up if they would come out with it in Hybrid.
To the poster who commented on how the $3500 extra for a hybrid took about 15 year to make up in gas.... I have one comment I received a $3000 tax break because I bought the car. hmmm. I think that about made up for it in 1 year. So there is always that incentive.
I had a Prius but had to trade it in when when our family grew from just 2 dogs to dogs + babies. I miss the Prius, but I also love my Mazda MPV with the power doors on both sides. What I really want is a hybrid minivan WITH POWER DOORS!
Please,I am lso waiting for this Toyota Sienna Hybrid.I do love the comfort of a minivan,and it will be an added bonus to be able to save on gas too.!!Please Japanese - Toyota Big Kahunas
ake the minivans hybrid available to US!!!
I'm writing from Bermuda,we have the toyota alphard here ,but can't get the alphard hybrid yet.At $6:50 a gallon of fuel here Toyota needs to let off that sporty hybrid van to the rest of the world.I'm waiting in vain for it.We drive on the left any way.
There must be a conspiracy here. Judging from this huge list, there is obviously a demand for hybrid minivans in North America; I'd also buy one in a minute. The only thing is that with Toyota and Honda selling every minivan they make, they really have no business motivation for making them. It would seem obvious that Ford or GM with no one wanting their lukewarm offerings except at breathtaking discounts should take the lead so why aren't they? Yes, Ford and GM I'd buy one off of you, just to make a statement!
A recent trip to our Toyota dealer seems to confirm the 2008 Hybrid minivan release date. We were looking at the current hybrid options and lamented the lack of a Hybrid minivan. Our salesman indicated Toyota was looking to introduce a redesigned Sienna and Sienna hybrid in 2008, but he didn't have specific details.
The car I'm currently driving is paid for, I can wait for 2008.
I would not rely on the 2008 date. When we needed a second car in 1999, Toyota was already advertising a hybrid called the Prius to be released in early 2000. We waited. It got moved to spring of 2000. Then summer. We finally bought an Echo (worst Toyota ever!) in June, and the Prius came out the very next month.
This time, we're determined to stick it out until ANY company comes out with a hybrid minivan that gets 40 mpg. Heck, I'm so desperate I'd buy a GM! Toyota's excuses are lame. If they're not profitable enough, increase the price. Demand is certainly there. And how hard is it to shift a right-hand drive to a left-hand drive on the Japanese Estima to get it over here sooner rather than later? Back in 1987 I swore never to own a car that got under 30 mpg. It's almost twenty years later and they can't hit 40 mpg? Give me a break!
The kids can survive being "Tetrisised" into the Echo for a couple more years. After that, we'll buy a non-Toyota hybrid out of sheer spite. (And if you want real fun, fit two adults and two kids into an Echo for a week-long trip to Disneyland).
put me on the list, but why doesn't someone else come out with a hybrid mini-van???? Kia, Hyundai, Honda, etc, etc????? Looks like many of us don't care who comes out with one, just come out with a good one!
if you have$
import this
http://www.batfa.com/new_car_toyota_alphard_hybrid.htm
more details
http://www.toyota.com.hk/showroom/alphard/
then buy
http://www.nightdriver.com/?d=how_to_buy
install eye on rooftop for best results
Just saw this in Grist on-line magazine
Plugs and Kisses
Toyota considering plug-in hybrids and flex-fuel vehicles for U.S.
Toyota plans to develop a plug-in hybrid vehicle, the company announced last week. Rechargeable via any typical electrical outlet, a plug-in would be able to "travel greater distances without using its gas engine, ... conserve more oil, and slice smog and greenhouse gases to nearly imperceptible levels," said Jim Press, president of Toyota's North American subsidiary. The technology is far from ready, and the automaker has no timeline for offering the cars for sale, but hey -- we'll give it points for pressing forward with the R&D while other companies dawdle. Toyota is also taking a serious look at bringing flex-fuel cars capable of running on an E85 ethanol blend to the U.S. market, putting pressure on America's beleaguered Big Three automakers, who recently announced that they will double production of flex-fuel vehicles. Toyota already produces E85-capable vehicles in Brazil. Toyota, which dominates the regular hybrid market, also plans to introduce hybrid versions of all its current vehicle models.
straight to the source: Detroit Free Press, Justin Hyde, 19 Jul 2006
straight to the source: Reuters, John Crawley, 19 Jul 2006
straight to the source: The Courier-Journal, Associated Press, Ken Thomas, 19 Jul 2006
I'm hoping this is true since we stayed with the American made and bought a used '99 Windstar (esp since my brother was working for Ford and got us a great deal and would be able to fix the car for us). It is a 7 seater and we can just fit our family of 6 in it. When we need to bring the dog along it is difficult. My kids are on the younger side so as long as a friend doesn't need a car seat we have 1 seat for a friend, but another adult would be difficult. Right now baby #5 is due next year and we're thinking we're really going to need an 8 seater since we will have 3 in car seats and one in a booster. I'm really hoping Honda or Toyota will do something about the hybrid minivan, esp since they make the only two 8 seater mini vans. I can't keep paying $10 to drive to a dr appt! WIth all the traffic lights and stop and go traffic here in NJ I think that is about what I am paying for driving 1/2 hour to my chiro and the health food store 2 towns away. Anyone know anything about this article I posted?
I echo many of the sentiments expressed above. We own a Prius and absolutely love it, except that we really could use more room. It's difficult to fit large items in it - with a car seat in the back we can't put the seats down. The curved roof makes it difficult to put anything on top. Any suggestions on how to fit more in or on a Prius would be welcome!
Our other car, a Toyota Camry, has served us well, but is over 10 years old. With another baby on the way and a desire to travel (and do-it-youself at home), we need a larger vehicle. We don't need more power, just more room. We don't want the Highlander - too expensive and not a full hybrid. We've been considering a Ford Escape, but we don't want to support Ford and it's not really what we want. What we want is a minivan with good gas mileage - anything less than 40 mpg is really unacceptable - and cleaner or no exhaust. I just need enough power to be able to pull out safely into traffic and get up hills. Is anybody listening? I'd buy a hybrid Sienna now if it were an acceptable price. I don't know if we can wait until next year, with no positive proof that there's one coming out. I just wonder what our fellow consumers are thinking, buying gas guzzlers and dirty exhausts. I can't believe that Hummers are even allowed to exist.
Why don't you consider the Highlander a full hybrid? It's a vehicle with different requirements such a towing, but I get 29-30 mpg combined milage.
The American auto manufacturers have done it to themselves with less than impressive Engineering. THe first aitomaker to bring a Hybrid Mini-van to the US will do extremely well. We are waiting to purchase one of these vehicles and also are not interested in support Ford Motor Company.
Mike
Does anyone know why they won't introduce a hybrd minivan in the US. THere must be some greedy reason.
I'd buy a hybrid minivan in a heartbeat if one was available, whether it's Honda or Toyota or (gasp!) GM.
What's going on inside Toyota's marketing dept, one must wonder. The technology is there, the demand is there, the tax incentives are there. What are they waiting for?
I think that one reason the hybrid minivan is taking so long to get here is the same problem Toyota has with the rest of their hybrids: not enough parts to go around. I google hybrid minivan all the time just to see if one is coming out here in the US. I don't know if I could afford one right now, but in 5 years, I would buy one in a second.
I too would buy a Hybrid Minivan asap!!! I only have two kids, but always have plenty of others I'd like to bring along. It's only logical that somebody would do something to get us.. U.S. one on the market. Can anybody think of a reason why they aren't????????????????
I WANT ONE NOW!!!!
Check out press release on redesigned Estima for the Japanese market. the THS II system takes Synnery Drive and customizes it specifically for minivan hybrids...
http://www.toyota.co.jp/en/news/06/0612_2.html
As many of the posters have already stated, I would also buy a hybrid minivan in a second. I can't believe how backwards we are in U.S. Japan has had the Estima out on the market for a number of years now. What is taking the U.S. so long?
I have three children all needing car seats--the options for fuel efficient cars is pretty much non-existent--and no, the Highlander is way too small (most impractical car I've seen). I would love a van that can seat 8, has room for sports equipment, is fuel efficient, good on the environment and reliable. I will fork out the extra money for it. I don't need the crazy power of a V6 or V8 for that matter...just give me a darn van that will run and get me from point A to point B. I am not a race driver and I just can't see how 10 seconds will really make a difference in getting me from point A to point B.
We currently have a Previa that is wonderful. The Previa (which is the old Estima) is fantastic...they should have updated this van and included the hybrid as one of the options.
The greedy, greedy businesses!
Steve,
Thanks for that link - the hybrid Estima looks great! I wish it were on the market in the U.S.
I'm a foster parent of 4 children and am expecting 2 more. I need a hybrid minivan. I have a Ford Windstar which does okay on the highway. It's the transporting around town that is the killer. I'll be sending a message to Toyota and all the other dealerships with a 8 seat capacity hybrid request.
I am ready to buy tomorrow a Hybrid Van, I don't think I will care much who makes it, just get one.
I caon't believe it has taken this long.... the Hybrid rockets for 4 or 5 passengers are really seeming a bit silly... 400 Horses and no fuel economy.... gee what is the point here?
If two of your kids are between the ages of 4 to 9 then you might consider the Highlander hybrid. The third row seat is for kids of those ages. Total capacity is seven.
I have one right now. I have a one year old and a five year old. I know I will be using this for the next 4-8 years and I know that my kids will enjoy their personal space back there.
I am averaging 28 MPG and I can squeeze it to as high as 38-40 MPG in city driving. I use a scangauge to keep track of my fuel usage.
I have an 11 year old Subaru legacy and my husband has a 2001 prius. I am desperate for new car but want a hybrid. I have to growing children and I tried the hylander - the third row seats were very uncomfortable and with those up, no trunk space. I even drove the camry - but the battery is in the trunk - so no trunck space. I have been all over the web, and the date of delivery of the hybrid minivan is fluid - with high hopes of a 2008 to be delivered in May (like they did with the 07 camry -e arly release). If I knew for sure, I would wait until May- but I am really ready for a new car and want a hybrid but no good alternatives! Im frustrated!!!
Come on Toyota, put out the minivan - there would be lines out the door and sales would be through the roof!
No url
A few facts about the Estima Hybrid;
The fuel economy for the average person is NOT 40 MPG, Look at about 25 to 30 for Suburban driving. If you do short trips (under 10 mins), expect around 10 kpl (metric is easer for me as display is in metric so you will have to convert).
Once it warms up you can get around the 12kpl to 14kpl on a trip (100kph) as long as the road is reasonably flat. I have noticed if you can draft behind a rig it goes up to 16 to 18 kpl (2 seconds behind). Best fuel economy speed is around 60 kph, it then goes up to 18 kpl.
I have not been able to Pulse & glide it. For some reason it wouldn't do it.
It has lots of room for the passaengers but not too much trunk space. This is due to the battieries beening under the rear seat. The rear seat can only tilt forward (Not slide, although the 2006 one can due to the batteries being under the dash).
I am pleased with it as the old Estima was only getting 6 kpl around town and 8.5 kpl on a trip.
I wouldn't import one into the USA for these reasons;
Light beams will shine the wrong way (you will have to change them,
Spare parts will be 0
Toyota will not suport them as they will have to get the Estima software to Dianostic it (7 computers in it) and I can't see them doing that.
I am leasing a sienna right now and it has fairly great fuel economy for its size. Averaging 18-20 MPG per tank. On long drives fully loaded with people and stuff, it managed to average at 24 MPG which is pretty impressive in my book.
My highlander hybrid gets the same mileage on similar 24-25 MPG on long trips but each tank averages 27-28 MPG.
By the time my sienna lease is up, it will be just the right time to hybrid estima.
Well crap!
I just noticed the change to the 2008 on the Sienna hybrid. I talked to my local Toyota dealer and they said don't hold your breath on that either.
I can get 2 more years out of my Accord, I think. Then I have to buy something. Hope it will be a hybrid van.
Are you listening Toyota???
I might know why they are hesitant to sell them in the US...base starting cost would be about $31,127 and the top model is running about $38,298 plus delivery.
I pulled the specs and costs from http://www.toyota.co.jp/en/news/06/0612_2.html
I want a hybrid minivan too
The only company that can bring a hybrid minivan to the market ASAP is Toyota. We should all drive into Toyota dealerships with our old Toyota or brand new Honda telling them we refuse to buy another Toyota before they bring the SH (Sienna hybrid) to the US they have the Estima & the Alphard in Japan, Y R we 2nd class
Lets see,
A massive hole in the market, huge demand, and the product already exists. How could Toyota screw this up? I'd buy one tomorrow.
Listen Toyota!!!!
If I could get a AWD Hybrid Minivan at a decent price, I'd sell my Honda Odyssey in a heart beat.
Looks like Chevy :confused: is going to be my next Hybrid. I checked and the first 6 adult hybrid is likely to be the Tahoe, and I know from my Aunt who owns one, that you can fit 6-7 adults easy in it.
It should end up getting around 25 mpg. Best right now is the Sienna at 22 mpg. I think GM will be a lot more aggressive about getting a hybrid to market than Toyota will, since GM is in crisis mode right now.
An added bonus will be that it can run E85 which they are selling down the street. That combined with the 25 mpg should mean that my oil consumption will down to about 60 mpg :rolleyes: which is what I'm at in my prius right now!
Dan - <11011011> - Compare to - '96 MX-6 - & - '02 Odyssey @ EPA's MyMPG database
If you all aren't too stuck on hybrids, rumors are that Honda may put their upcoming clean diesel engine in a mini-van for the US. It should easily match a hybrid mini-van in MPG... but again, that still won't be for a couple years...
I have been waiting (not so patiently) for almost four years for a hybrid minivan. I refuse to buy one of the current gas-guzzlers, but it is really getting hard to transport 2 adults, 2 kids and their car seats, 1 dog and gear in a Honda Civic!!
Does anyone have any encouraging news?
I've signed the others (can't remember where), but here's the latest petition..
Sign it if you have the chance..
http://ucsaction.org/campaign/04_18_07_Toyota_Hybrid_Minivan
Other links of interest:
Article:
http://ucsaction.org/campaign/04_18_07_Toyota_Hybrid_Minivan
Digg (URL top 40 service):
http://www.digg.com/environment/Help_Bring_Toyota_s_Lovely_Hybrid_Minivan_to_the_U_S
11011011
Here is a link below for a petition to sign to help bring the Toyota Minivan to the US market, it would be great if they brought it here.
http://ucsaction.org/campaign/04_18_07_Toyota_Hybrid_Minivan
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Well, I just got back from Bangkok and from what I can tell there is only one Hybrid vehicle roaming the streets of Thailand... Yes! You guessed it! The Toyota Minivan Hybrid. I saw many of them!!! No Priuses, No Ford Escape Hybrids, No Camry Hybrids, No Nissan Hybrids... but many Toyota Hybrid Minvans... I am still looking for it on the internet but here are some other interesting links:
http://www.toyota.co.th/red/en/index.asp
(Toyota's Thailand Website in English)
http://hybrid.toyota-asia.com/base.htm
(Note: May take a few minutes to load)
Why are the Japanese holding back their Toyota Sienna Hybrid Minivan? They would sell like 'hotcakes' in America! They have been teasing us the last few years (since 2005, I think), telling us we would have it by '06, no '07,no wait '08. If they don't want to share, they just need to tell us.
I have been driving minivans for 10 years, & I have no desire to purchase a SUV or a car. So, if someone doesn't follow through with a Hybrid minivan soon, I'll just buy another non-Hybrid minivan.
Think that right there is the crux of the issue. Toyota and Honda have higher margin on non-Hybrids than they do on Hybrids. Volume is what's pushing the hybrid market. The point of a hybrid in the market right now is to entice people away from other purchases. If for example they are down-sizing from an SUV to a cross-over they may step back and get an Explorer Hybrid. If they are downsizing to a sedan, they may just get a Civic Hybrid or Prius.
Point is, people who need a minivan (like us) are going to get a minivan regardless. They will probably try to get the one with the best MPG, but right now Toyota and Honda are neck and neck. There is no high occupancy vehicle that comes close to a minivan in MPG. Until someone comes out with a Navigator getting 35-40 mpg, there is little incentive for Toyota or Honda to move a high margin line to a low margin line.
So it's not about money, it's all about image. So from what I've read about Toyota, they plan to eventually offer HSD as an option on all vehicles. This point as vanished and reappeared a few times, but it may eventually happen. The first quote put this at 2010, I personally don't think it will happen till around 2015. But I see no indication that either maker will move to a hybrid minivan in the next 4 years.
Just my opinion
11011011
Election year!
What is Toyota waiting for!! I am in desperate need of a new van, my Odyssey is almost 11 years old and has well over 200k miles on it. It's also too short to transport my daughter and her wheelchair.I don't have the luxury of driving anything OTHER than a van. My daughter's needs make it impossible for us to buy anything else. My husband and I have been holding out for a Japanese hybrid, but I have to say if one of the US companies comes out with a hybrid-van first we would seriously consider buying! Wake up Toyota!
I totally agree!!! Those needing a wheelchair accessible vehicle should have hybrid choices.
As for myself, I am pregnant with my 2nd child, and with 2 car seats, 2 parents, a big dog and stuff . . . I need a minivan. Yet I do NOT want to buy a gas-guzzler! Why is it that Japan got the option of a hybrid minivan back in 2001, and in 2008 the U.S. still does not have one for sale here?!!
Listen up automakers. There is a market here for you. You can help improve your "green" credentials AND make money!
I know it sounds like heresy but for those who need a vehicle with seating for 6 or more, the 'greenest' choice today is the GMC Yukon Hybrid. With an EPA fuel economy of 21 compared with Honda's Odyssey at 18 or Toyota's Sienna at 19, this could clearly be the winner for those who really need larger seating capacity.
I don't know how well a Yukon would meet jill's wheelchair accessibility needs and, of course, the Yukon Hybrid costs about twice the price of either of these minivans.
The fact that this huge monster is closing in on smaller, lighter vehicles shows how the electric drivetrain is reducing the impact that vehicle weight has on fuel economy.
We bought the Sienna when it first came out in 1998. I love my Sienna, but it's been 10 years now, and I want a new car. It is such a great car for family trips. I looking at new cars, and told my husband I wanted 2 things: a hybrid (extremely low emissions), and four-wheel drive for our occasional trips up the mountain for skiing. I would love to own another Sienna which could meet my new specs.
Next car we buy will definitely be hybrid, not only for the $ in gas savings, but also for the environmental aspect. If there are no hybrid minivans, I'll pay the higher price for Hybrid SUV models, even if the gas mileage is the same as current model minivans. It's about making a statement... and I won't be buying a minivan from any maker until it's hybrid!
Toyota needs to introduce it's hybrid version of it's Minivan ASAP... I have talked to several parents that are not purchasing a new minivan until a hybrid version is introduced.
Carmakers, please, listen to your customers! We are desperate for a hybrid minivan.
We have a 8 year old minivan and are waiting for a hybrid minivan. Toyota Sienna hybrid will be our first choice. Hurry up Toyota. Get that Sienna Hybrid in the market ASAP
If you want to let the auto makers know what you want, the best avenue is their corporate customer support. Here are the numbers for all of the big guys:
Chevrolet (800) 222-1020
Ford (800) 392-FORD (or 800-392-3673)
Ford Motor Company, Customer Relationship Center, PO Box 6248, Dearborn, Michigan 48126
Honda (800) 999-1009
Honda Automobile Customer Service, 1919 Torrance Boulevard, Mail Stop: 500 - 2N - 7D
Torrance, CA 90501-2746
Nissan (800) NISSAN-1 (or 800-647-7261)
Nissan Consumer Affairs, P.O. Box 685003, Franklin TN 37068-5003
Mercedes-Benz USA (800) FOR-MERCEDES or (1-800-367-6372)
Customer Assistance Center, 3 Paragon Drive, Montvale, N.J. 07645
Mitsubishi (888) MITSU2007 (or 888-648-7820)
Mitsubishi Motors North America, Inc., PO Box 6014, Cypress, CA 90630-0014
Saturn (800) 553-6000
Customer Assistance Center , 100 Saturn Parkway, MD-371-999-S24, Spring Hill, TN 37174
Subaru of America (800) SUBARU3 (or 800-782-2783) | email
Subaru of America, Inc., Subaru Plaza, P.O. Box 6000, Cherry Hill, NJ 08034-6000
Attn: Customer/Dealer Services
Toyota (800) 331-4331
Toyota Motor Sales, U.S.A., Inc. 19001 South Western Ave. Dept. WC11, Torrance, CA 90501
Thanks to Plug-in America for pulling these all together.
I just got off the phone with the customer service rep for Toyota (3/10/2008). He indicated that the Sienna will definitely not be released in the U.S. as a hybrid in 2008 (2009 model). What a disappointment. Looks like the 11 year old Sienna that we love, but is on its last legs will be replaced with a different manufacturer/model. Sorry Toyota, but I think you just lost another customer.
It is so strange to see all these posts from years ago and STILL no hybrid minivan in the U.S. I wonder why they deny this country a hybrid minivan when obviously there is a market here. My kids are almost grown now but we've been driving minivans for years and I really love them. They are so spacious and really get good gas mileage for their size, compared to some smaller cars which aren't a whole lot better. A hybrid would be awesome; does anyone have a clue what the reason is for the holdout here? The way the gas prices are soaring, I think I may have to go to riding a horse like in the olden days. FYI, just got back from a trip to TN to my home in IN and the pump prices here are almost 40cents higher than in TN, $3.49/gal. here, which is horrible. Can't see it getting any better if we don't have some sort of alternative fuel sources to eliminate the need for all that oil. Need the hybrids and other fuel sources to survive here.
I think they are just enjoying ripping us off at the gas station, I really hope they come out with a hybrid mini-van here in the states too. To bad they took away all the electric cars a few years ago, that would have been even better. Seriously though they get a whole lot more money by making gas only cars, obviously though...
So, I'm not the only person who badly wants a hybrid minivan!
My Chevy Astro van is falling apart and I have 5 kids-I just can't go for less than 7 seats. I dislike the Highlander, it's too high for us shorter folks to get in to easily. Dude, I'm stuck-I guess i'll dump some more $ into my aging van and hope for the best.
I will be first in line at a dealer that sells a hybrid minivan. Manufacters, are you listening? It's a slump, but us minivan folks WANT to spend $ on YOUR product!!! Hello???
One more vote for a hybrid van! And damn soon! Like bring a shipload of the Japanese hybrid vans over here now.
I have been waiting to buy a hybrid minivan. I can't wait much longer. Anyone know when it will ge here?
WOW!!!! I cannot believe we are not getting a hybrid minivan yet!!! Toyota and Honday need to get on the program like 3 years ago.
I would definitely buy a hybrid minivan if it were available! I am really surprised this isn't on the immediate horizon.
I also have an old falling apart car and three kids, an old volvo station wagon. I would love to buy a larger car, my oldest just hit 6 foot, but won't buy one that gets under 40 mpg. We put a friggin' man on the moon, surely we must be able to make a car for me?
I have been waiting for Toyota to offer the Sienna in a hybrid. I have a 2003 Sienna that desperately needs to be traded in.
Yo, Toyota!
What the HELL are you waiting for???
I drive a Dodge Caravan that gets 19mpg. I have been waiting for a Hybrid that seats 7 being that I have three kids. The Tahoe is really just a sorry excuse for a hybrid. I agree with the person above, we can put a man on the moon. But I can't help but to think the "man" wants to stop it, if you know what I mean. Every soccer mom in the US will drive on and they want us to buy a Tahoe instead.
I'm looking for a new minivan soon too. With three kids we need the room a minivan provides. And, I'm very interested in a hybrid version. The rumor has been running for 3 years now that a Hybrid Sienna is coming to the U.S. Market. Isn't Toyota listening? Or, maybe Toyota has some deal going on with Honda, Ford and the rest not to bring it here because they know they'd loose market share big time? Maybe it is some kind of oil company/car maker/governement consipracy. Where's the media investigation on this story? "What happened to the electric car was a good story"...I bet "Where's the hybrid minivan" might be even better!
Our 1998 Honda Odyssey is beginning to growl at me; my goal was to keep it until 200,000 miles, HOPING that by then there would be a hybrid mini-van. We won't make it much past 200k, so let's hope those car folks hustle up a bit!
ps Besides, how hard can this be?
Now here's a thought - I wonder what politicians would say if they saw this link where the idea has been discussed in vain for over three years? Honestly, the little people that want the hybrid mini-vans are not being heard... let's get the big guns to lobby on our behalf...
I just found this page. I was told 3 years ago by a Toyota sales rep that a hybrid minivan would be out any time now! I'm still waiting. It is nice to know I'm not the only one. With talk of gas being $4.00 a gallon minimum this summer what the heck are they waiting for. Does anyone know how to forward this entire sight to the auto makers &/or the Presidential candidates?
Just found this site in search of something that seats 6 or more! A Hybrid minivan is long overdue. I will not dump money into a tight 5 seater and then not be able to have guests and family ride with us on travels. An official from one of the manufactures needs to step in a reply on this blog and or make an official anouncement of their minivan plans.
Arthur Timmins
Wee, CA
And our gas just hit $3.99 gal a few days ago!
Arthur Timmins
Weed, CA
Well, we need this Toyota Sienna Hybrid NOW. How much longer we have to wait? How much more fortune we have to spend on gas before Toyota Hybrid Sienna sees the light of the day.
Toyota needs to make a official statement regarding this.
Toyota Please help us out, please send Toyota Sienna Hybrid to US soon.
When hybrid technology can be put in Highlander, why can't same be put in Sienna and shipped to US?
Lets send a petition to Toyota. When Toyota can release hybrid vans in Japan, why not in US?
Time to take some action, because obviously neither Toyota neither Honda are reading these posts. We can put these comments in a petition and send to Toyota/Honda representatives.
Please suggest....
maybe Toyota or Honda afraid of losing market of their SUV product lines.
We at Toyota decided that you do not deserve a hybrid minivan. You are just a bunch of whining losers. Go to hell ! We are also going to scrap the sales of Prius and Camry if don't stop whining.
Amen.
Hello everyone --
Just let Toyota know directly from their website below. I just sent them a link to this page.
Here's the link to their contacts page:
http://www.toyota.com/help/contactus.html
I find it hard to believe they could be unaware of the demand for a hybrid mini-van, but you never know!
Hello agaiin --
The response from Toyota appears below. If you really want a hybrid mini-van, let Toyota know! http://www.toyota.com/help/contactus.html
And tell them you will be shopping around for other more fuel effecient options for large passenger capacity vehicles. As an earlier post suggests, their profit margins on non-hybrid vehicles are greater than on hybrids, so the may have no incentive to offer the hybrid mini-van option, especially if they believe customers will just settle for one of their non-hybrid mini-vans. Tell them you won't settle but go elsewhere!
Toyota responds:
Thank you for contacting Toyota Motor Sales, U.S.A., Inc.
We appreciate your interest in our hybrid technology.
I apologize; we do not currently have any plans to announce the introduction of a hybrid Sienna in the U.S. We are, however, aware of consumer interest, and consistently strive to remain competitive in today's market. Your comments and interest in this type of vehicle have been documented at our National Headquarters, where they remain available to the appropriate departments. We appreciate your input.
We invite you to visit our Environmental Technologies and Hybrid Technology Availability for Other Toyotas FAQ’s (Frequently Asked Questions) to review more detailed information on these topics.
Thank you again for your interest!
Your email has been documented at our National Headquarters under file #XXXXXXXXXXX. If we can be of further assistance, please feel free to contact us.
...
Sincerely,
Toyota Customer Experience
We love our Odyssey. We pamper it. We tout it. We absolutely relish it. But I would take the day off from work tomorrow to replace it with a "real" hybrid minivan, regardless of the manufacturer. With gas prices over $4.00 now, at least in San Francisco, I've actually found myself "filling up" more often now so that I don't have to actually see what it costs to fill it on an empty tank.
Hell - Even Porsche is building a hybrid Cayenne. Toyota is playing some kind of game - no?
Well - I'll continue to give my business to the pump until a hybrid minivan arrives, and I'll be as high on the waiting list as possible for that day as well.
Alright Toyota, I love your cars and we all know they hold up, well, better than any other car out there. So, as much as the little redneck tendancies in us love NASCAR, it is time to satisfy your recurring customers. Bring the hybrid minivan over the ocean to the US! You know it will sell so just do it!!!!
Once I found Toyota, I became a recurring customer. Sadly my husband was into Dodge and some how talked me into a Durango, we were not married yet, I think I was trying to humor him. The Durango has lived it's years and while it is still rolling on the roads, it is beginning to make strange noices! I am patiently waiting for your Hybrid Mini before I purchase a new car. Please don't wait long enough for myself and my 1 and 2 year old children to be stranded on the side of the road! Bring the hybrid mini!!!!
Hey all you others, I say we all go in together and order and purchace the hybrid mini over in Japan. Maybe with the "Bulk" order they will give us a discount on the boat to get them over here! Cars get shipped over for those in the military and such, maybe we can get them over here for a munch of strung out tired exahusted moms with a pack of screaming kids!
Not only do we need hybrid technology in mini-vans, but Toyota should offer station wagons as well. I live in Germany and the selection is far greater than in the United States.
http://www.toyota.de/cars/new_cars/avensis/index.aspx
This would give those who don't want or need a SUV or Mini-van a choice.
Why do they waste hybrid technology on small cars?
Is there any update on hybrid mini-vans? I keep hearing Toyota promises, all the way back to 2001, but still don't see any real commitment. I would buy two and replace both my minivan and my compact car if the hybrid was available. With 3 small children, there is no way I can give up a mini-van for a compact hybrid.
I desperately want a minivan...but with gas prices the way they are I can't imagine monthly payments as well as spending over $200 a month in gas to for the current minivans. If a hybrid van was to come out....I would purchase one today!
I desperately want a minivan...but with gas prices the way they are I can't imagine monthly payments as well as spending over $200 a month in gas to for the current minivans. If a hybrid van was to come out....I would purchase one today!
Toyota Hybrid Mini-Van please; otherwise, Hyundai and Kia make better minivans. Toyota only advantage now is Hybrid. If they do not make one soon... Customers will flock to Korean Mini-Vans.
Add me to the growing list of those upset by the lack of hybrid mini-vans on the market. Granted, gas pries are a concern, but that is beside the point for me. What about working toward a more sustainable mode of living? Hybrids are helping that to some degree. I am willing to pay a little more for a hybrid simply because it is the "right" thing to do.
Surely the automotive industry has hear our cries. And we are still waiting for an answer. At what point should we expect big business to listen to the consumer? At what point should we expect big business to do the right thing?
I guess we have an answer in their silence...
Add my vote to the list of those interested in buying a Toyota hybrid mini-van. A hybrid Sienna would be great for our family.
i have a hybrid mini van!
I can't believe there isn't one already, it makes the most sense to me. Minivan owners aren't trying to be cool or buy something that's bigger/better. They are looking for a practical car that fits their family and their stuff. I'll need to switch from a wagon to a minivan in the near future, but the drop in mileage is a huge concern. I would guess this that a hybrid minivan would be one of the top selling hybrids on the market, if not the top.
I will trade in my 2001 Chrysler T&C for a Hybrid minivan the day it is available. I like the Highlander Hybrid ok, but I want a hybrid minivan.
Where did you buy this ?
what is the make and modle of your hybrid minivan and where did you get it or where do you live?
I find you people quite un-educated... Mini van Hybrid= No market for it! It's one thing to ask for it online... But one thing to pay 30-40k for a veh.
A hybrid minivan would sell like hotcakes without a doubt. Anyone who does not think so has their head in the sand. Lots of us would like the space a minivan offers our families. Right now to get a well outfitted minivan will cost you at least 30K. Give me a minivan from Toyota or Honda with the options I want and at least 40 MPG and I have no problem paying 40K. To me the extra 10K is worth it. The economy and the environment is at the perfect moment for it. I even considered bringing over the Toyota from Japan to get one the paperwork was a tad much for me.
Thanks to Honda and Toyota's efforts on the MPG front I feel very loyal to them. The fact that they still will not bring a hybrid minivan to the US market brings them a notch down to the low class level of companies like GM and Chrysler.
how about the new diesel minivan from VW. diesel cost more but you go further and you can convert to veggie oil and go greener!
1. add me to the list of potential hybrid minivan buyers.
2. scott - what type of change would be required to the diesel VW to have it run on veggie oil?
With all due respect, a fully outfitted Sienna XLE costs upwards of 54K in Canada and they are still selling well.
40k for Hybrid Sienna or Odyssey is an amount I would have no problem paying. But that's just me.
I would like to purchase a high quality Hybrid MiniVan in the United States.....soon!!
Hello skippy,
i don't know much about this yet . i have just started the research. so far i have found a place in Oberlin Ohio, which is close to my house, it is called full circle fuels. just google them. they tell me that it cost about 3k to convert to the new system and veggie fuel at the pump is $2.50 a gallon. the only problem i have is that is not that close to my house to just go get a tank of veggie fuel. so if i decide to do this, i will buy a small trailer and a 300 gallon water tank and drive there once every two months and buy fuel. i know it sound like alot of work but i can only compair it to getting firer wood for a wood burring stove. not that hard just a little leg work and little more cash. i think if i were to do this the savings would take longer but my carbon foot print will change immediately.
the other place is called love craft fuels, they are lower CA and they have a single tank system.
sorry for getting off track, the changes made are a second tank,separate fuel line and a small electric heater to warm the fuel, filters and a small electric control modulator. the ECM will tell some thing don't shut off yet we are running on oil not Diesel. the car will need to start on Diesel and end on diesel.
there is a lot of pod cast on itunes that would be a better source than me. but check with these web site that i have talk about these people are real Diesel geeks.
In my opinion Diesel has a long track record and hybrid technology is just in its 2 or 3rd generation right now, so i am on the fence. i reallly want a plug in hybrid. www.pluginamerica.com
I would love to know how long we have to wait for the hybrid minivans to hit the US market so we can at least determine if it is worth the wait or if we should move on to other options. Does anyone know a time frame?
We can put a man on the moon, but we can't get a Hybrid minivan in North America?!
Come on people!
man on the man involved "big oil".
how much fuel do it take to get to the moon.....? thats why
What's the best/fastest way to learn about a hybrid minivan on the market?
It seems like a high power 4 cyl diesel, combined with about 40 hp of electric on the rear wheels would be a great combination. The electrics would give great acceleration and regeneration and AWD without a driveshaft. --Tom, (who also can't figure the delay on this.)
Even if we get Hybrid RAV4 it will be great. Toyota and Honda are top notch. Please keep it that way, see.
Does any one know if the SIenna or RAV4 hybriids are in design stage right now? Possibly by 2009 these will come out?
We are optimistic.
I need to replace my '96 minivan, and would love to purchase a hybrid. Why are there hybrid SUVs but not minivans? How long will I have to wait? Whoever offers one first has a huge opportunity!
I would love I get one of the hybrid Toyota minivans or a plug-in hybrid SUVs as soon as one of them is available in US.
The 2008 Toyota Sienna gets 19.5 mpg average. If they put hybrid technology into it, it should get around 30 mpg.
That's a minivan I would buy today. Wake up Toyota.
If you think we live in a free market your crazy. I am sure there is some kind of deal between our "leaders" and theirs to not sell a toyota hybrid in the stats so to help protect GM and Ford.
Toyota is in the works of spinning of a division of Hybrids, probably called "Prius" since that was their baby. I believe that they're done hybrid-ing out existing models. They will probably create a new hybrid vehicle that would fall closest into the "Crossover" category... Larger than a Prius, but smaller than an SUV. And of course, they'll probably roll out some sort of ugly truck that'll be adopted with cultish appreciation (FJ cruiser). They'll probably release these vehicles in the 2009 or 2010 model years. Then they'll have the Prius, Camry, Highlander, HybridX, Hybrid Truck and a fairly large market share.
At the same time, remember that Toyota developed Hybrid Synergy technology over 10 years ago and blew our minds with it (explained by the 3 year string of comments on this post). Right now, their brilliant minds probably are not creating late-to-market solutions, but they're creating solutions for the future (Plug-in Hybrids, All Electric, Fuel Cell Hydrogen etc.). This is the reason that Toyota stock is traded for nearly 3x the price of Honda and almost 15x the price of Ford.
I too would like a hybrid mini-van, but I'm looking forward to Toyota knocking my socks off with their alternative.
AZmpg,
I wish I was as optimistic as you are about Toyota. Remember, this is the same Toyota that has already orphaned their All Electric RAV4EV and crushed hundreds of them. Hydrogen Fuel cells are a scam that was used by Toyota and the other majors to justify crushing the RAV4EV - they're too complicated, expensive, and inefficient to be of any use for automobiles in the foreseeable future. Toyota is also a big part of the push on the state of California to get Zero Emission Vehicle credit for 'depletion' hybrids that still require the use of gasoline to operate on the highway.
The only reason Toyota went with the Prius hybrid was that they were afraid that GM would introduce one in the late '90's. GM pulled theirs from the market so Toyota was left ruling the roost.
To Toyota's credit, they weren't dumb enough to kill the Prius although there was a lot of pressure to do so within Toyota.
Ask yourself: If Toyota really wanted to promote hybrids across their product line, why haven't they created a hybrid version of the Solara over the past 10 years? The Solara is just a 2-door version of the Camry which is offered as a hybrid. Do they prefer that hybrids be for slow, boring people only?
I hope Toyota comes up with a hybrid mini-van as well but I wouldn't hold my breath. Profit margins are low on mini-vans.
ex-EV1 driver,
Great post, great information and great tone... there are so many people that get WAY too emotional on these forums and their info and insight gets lost in their insults. I appreciate your knowledge.
I am VERY optimistic about Toyota, if nothing else, it's by their $111 BILLION in equity. Our friends over at GM are scrounging around at $-3 Billion and Honda is around $42 Billion. I don't think that they're going to invest any more money in changing current models into Hybrids; the current designs are not light enough or aero dynamic enough to provide adequate fuel savings.
Obviously large motor companies are driven by large oil companies and by profits, so they have to try to make the most marketable products with the highest returns. What they attempted to do with the Prius and were successful, is made people believe that paying an extra couple thousand dollars, you're going to save money over time (for some, this was the case but for most it wasn't, and they never cared to do the math). What they accomplished without trying was start a paradigm shift in the US. Before it was bigger is better, and just like in the 70s Japanese Auto Makers swoop in and make people think twice about a large American car. Even more - they got people thinking about being GREEN all together! If it weren't for the Prius, we wouldn't have a discovery channel offspring, "green planet" and Al Gore wouldn't have won the Nobel Prize.
The reality that we lived in was that Oil would always be there and Global warming wouldn't affect us for another million years or so.
Example... I live in Arizona the state that absorbs the most sun radiation in the country... We collect less solar energy per capita than NEW JERSY! If we collected HALF of the solar energy that falls on Maricopa County (the county where Phoenix/Mesa/Scottsdale sit) we would collect enough sun energy to power the (get ready) ENTIRE UNITED STATES!
But alas, "Alt energy is too expensive. Why change things". Now that the country is FINALLY moving (on the back of Hybrid Cars), we are going to see major changes.
So to get back to the point of this blog! (Sorry I tend to rant) I'm expecting to see Li-Ion batteries, I still believe in Hydrogen fuel cells, and Plug-In Hybrids are the next wave. OH and the only reason that I want a hybrid minivan is because I've got a new baby and plan to have a couple more, and two car seats in the back of the Prius is a little tight. We'll get a bigger something, and it would be nice to have a little better fuel economy than the standard Sienna and Odyssey.
Exactly me too Brad. 2000 T&C and want a new hybrid van. Have the highlander hybrid for work. It is about the best vehicle I have owned and I have owned Lexus and others.
I like the idea about us all getting together and going to Toyota as a group to get a shipment of hybrid minivans from Japan.
I'm not positive, but I think they drive on the Brittish side of the road over there in Japan. I know that it has been done (driving on the right side of a car on the right side of the road), I see my mail man do it every day, but that might be the reason they go "postal".
If you want Toyota to make a hybrid mini-van, tell them:
http://www.toyota.com/help/contactus.html
I already have and they said they have no plans to make or sell a hybrid minivan in the U.S. This was 2 months ago. Looks like its not coming for 2009 atleast. Maybe everyone here can convince them for 2010?
I am going to buy a used T&C in protest or just wait it out a little longer. I am so irritated.
I recently spoke with a Toyota representative with some inside information. He stated that Toyota will be 100% hybrid by 2012. He also stated that there would be a mass produced plug in all electric version of Prius out next year. I forgot to ask if that would be 2009 or 2010.
Hey Kalamazoo Dad,
Toyota has been saying for years they were going to have a hybrid version of every model... I wouldn't hold your breath, because it still hasn't happened...
I like the idea of sending an email to Toyota to voice opinion. Could take this a step further and send emails, letters, faxes, etc. to all car makers on a regular basis as time permits (daily, weekly, etc.) if nothing else but to ANNOY the heck out of them until they listen. If they are flooded by enough people they will be more likely to pay attention!
Could even do it as a collective group??
Looks like Chrysler and VW may beat Toyota to the punch with both hybrid and diesel mini-vans:
http://www.canada.com/topics/news/story.html?id=c16c50a5-0ca3-4761-a09d-...
The article says Toyota will have one in 2010...
My uncle owns several Toyota dealerships and I was told that the Sienna will be available in Canada in about 4 years.
That is tru families need hybrid minivans
There's a new campaign that's just been launched to get Toyota and Honda and other automakers to listen.
Check it out:
http://www.thepoint.com/campaigns/let-s-bring-hybrid-minivans-to-the-sub...
There's a new campaign that's just been launched to get Toyota and Honda and other automakers to listen.
Check it out:
http://www.thepoint.com/campaigns/let-s-bring-hybrid-minivans-to-the-sub...
There's a new campaign that's just been launched to get Toyota and Honda and other automakers to listen.
Check it out:
http://www.thepoint.com/campaigns/let-s-bring-hybrid-minivans-to-the-sub...
WE NEED AN HYBRID MINIVAN!!!
I'm waiting for a hybrid minivan--in fact, Americans need a fleet of hybrid cars to suit every individual need.
Toyota could provide this right away. Why are they not?
Will an American car company step up? Finally? Or will they continue to amount debt or go into bankruptcy?
I am about to buy Toyota Sienna, will it better for me to wait for the Hybrid model!!!
Naveed,
It will be a couple of years before there's a hybrid minivan on the market. If you can wait that long fine, otherwise, get what you need.
You might look to see iff you can get by with a hybrid sedan or SUV (the Toyota Highlander Hybrid can carry 7 people), otherwise, take care of your family now and get your finances lined up so your next car can be a hybrid.
PLEASE!!!!!!!! Give us a hybrid Sienna, this is what I am waiting for. I will buy a Sienna or Odessey which ever releases in the US market first. I have seen pictures of a test Odessey driving around New York, hurry up Toyota. You better tell your dellers to stop padding the hybrid prices or Nissan and Honda are going to squeeze you out.
send the message to the manufactureres that we won't buy until they give us the hybrids. As for me I have a really used taurus (120,000 miles), and I will keep it running until they get it done. I have signed many petitions letting them know that I am serious about my desires. Join in and change our planet. Who out there is tired of the oil and auto industry dictating our future. Learn all you can about the coralation between the two, it is discusting.
The Estima van in Japan looks nice - it is smaller than the Sienna (don't know exactly how much smaller) and it has a 4cyl engine plus AWD via an electric engine in the rear. This van likely gets almost double the mileage of the AWD Sienna, and has reasonable power (excellent tourque on takeoff), and seats 7 or 8. It seems to me that this would not be a Sienna, but rather its own model. If Toyota drops the V6 hybrid power plant from their SUVs into the Sienna, then I won;t likely buy one. The mileage boost will likely be small. Getting AWD without any mileage or spare tire penalty is great. The more you drive the better.
I would buy a hybrid minivan so fast it would make your head spin. I don't care who makes it--Toyota, Honda, or anyone else--I would be first in line wherever they were being sold.
Yes, the Toyota Highlander Hybrid is rated for 7 peeps, but the 3rd row should be reserved for folks you don't like. Also, it's a power hybrid rather than an economy hybrid. It's faster than the normal Highlander and gets somewhat better mileage.
I just read that the Highlander will be available with a 2.5 liter(approx) 4 with better mileage. Hopefully they will make an economy hybrid out of that one.
A minivan is much heavier, so they may be waiting for Li batteries to be perfected.
I am hoping ultra capacitors will supplant batteries anyway. I don't think they have an expected lifetime. The accept and deliver energy much more quickly than batteries too.
California law requires the batteries to be warranted for 10 years or 150K miles.
Ron
I second that!
I'm thinking it's time. Maybe there burning the midnight oil to try to put something together in Detroit?!
I want a plug-in AWD hybrid minivan the size of a Sienna or Odyssey or Grand Caravan with easily removable (or sto'n'go) middle row seats and a fold-flat back seat (adjustable fore and back like the 2nd gen Caravan). I'd strongly prefer electric motor(s) as the primary propulsion and a battery pack large enough to enable electric-only operation for at least a few miles. That might mean an electric motor on each wheel or one or two motors with "conventional-hybrid / cvt" transmission and differential(s).
I'd be OK with having the gas motor only recharge the batteries (though only the Volt and some military concept vehicles seem to be going that route now). The ideal gas motor in a hybrid Sienna would likely be the 2.4L motor used in the Camry, RAV4, hybrid Camry, and Estima. That motor runs forever, doesn't "sludge up" and doesn't require timing belt changes. 40 mpg (city or highway) would be a good target but I'd settle for 30 something.
A "performance hybrid" like the Lexus and Highlander is NOT what I'm looking for. I'm looking for dramatically better fuel economy even if it comes with a slight performance penalty when compared to a conventional v6 minivan.
I've driven minivans since 1990 (Voyager, Grand Caravan, Aerostar, Odyssey, Sienna). I think quiet high-speed interstate cruising is very important (I set the cruise control for about 80, my ex used to set it at 95 and burned-up several Odyssey transmissions) but 0-60 times are much less important. The original base Caravan with 4-cylinder Mitsubishi engine did just fine at everything except for uphill too-short on-ramps and passing trucks while climbing up mountains and I expect the extra torque from the electric motor(s) in a hybrid would fix those two issues. I well remember the old saying from engineering school that Americans "buy horsepower but drive torque."
FWIW, the fantasy version of my ideal hybrid minivan would have solar panels or solar-panel-paint all over so leaving it parked in the sun for a week while camping would enable a few miles of "free" driving. The glass would absorb 100% of UV and be electrochromatically adjustable to either admit or reflect infrared (in winter or summer, respectively). It would have the Odyssey's feel and driveability, the Sienna's reliability, Lexus' sound-proofing and stereo, the Chrysler's ergonomic-for-camping features (including no-head-bumping on the rear lift-gate), a perfectly-flat floor with seats folded/removed, tie-down points when used for cargo, hidden storage big enough for two sets of golf clubs and two laptops and a toolbox no matter whether the seats are up or folded, the ability to go 300 miles at 80 mph on electric power alone, a low drag coefficient, and the ground clearance of a small pickup or crossover (9 - 12" down the middle, possibly requiring an adjustable front air dam).
That's quite a spec . . . I doubt you'll get 300 miles going 80 mph from an all electric drvietrain any time soon - Tesla barely gets 200 miles out of their Roadster.
Putting aside the obvious technical limitations we face today, I'd like to see something similar to what you describe. Drop in a small 3 cylinder engine, two electric motors (one on each axle) and a small battery pack lets see what we have. I'd be happy with a more realistic 40 miles off pure battery power. With an engine that is tuned to always run at xxx rpm to recharge the system, fuel consumption, especially if it was diesel, would be minimal. But, really, at this point ANY hybrid minivan would be an instant success. Its about time.
I just found out that I am pregnant with my second child - where is that Toyota Sienna Hybrid??? I want it now!!!
Idiots at toyota are spending too much time developing the tundra and SUVs at their peril. Where is my hybrid minivan??? My kid will grad from college by the time the Toyota clan delivers a hybrid minivan. I hate Honda but if Toyota does not deliver a hybrid with sliding doors soon I will just buy an Odyssey. (Sliding doors reduces door dings) Oh yeah since you took so much time make it a plug-in. Thanks!!!
My next car is going to be a 4wd hybrid or diesel minivan. Who is going to step up to the plate? I thought it was going to be Chrysler when they had access to Mercedes technology, but they missed the boat and even dropped AWD from the current lineup. If toyota keeps sitting on its hands, maybe it will be one of the Korean makers. Somebody do it please.
PHEV Minivan !!
I would buy one TODAY!
The time is NOW.
WHY NO USA-HYBRID MINIVAN??? It was documented in multiple car magazines about five years ago after the Siena-like Hybrid was successfully shipping in Japan. UNTIL the latest oil company greed & Wash DC fiasco of “Big 3” execs with private jets, Wash DC WOULD HAVE levied protectionist taxes, fees & limits had Toyota imported their Hybrid Minivan even just a few years ago. It has been done many a time before for the likes of Harley Davidson & more than once for Chrysler.
Toyota (& others, not just Japan) was already killing the "Big 3" without it and consciously did NOT GO FOR THE KILL! I hope they do now – something is needed to push this change in mindset for sake of the world. Still today a “Big 3” car of similar HP is 20% less fuel efficient of an even larger Toyota model.
BUT PLEASE NOTE, I DO NOT WANT to buy foreign, it is just the track record of features, quality, reliability, etc. of companies like Toyota that drive my decisions (our Sequoia is more USA content than some of the “Big 3” SUV’s). In fact, right now I have the Ford Escape on our finalist list, but it is hard to pull the trigger EVEN with the current great deals out there.
PS – Still not convinced? Look at the focus at auto shows; at the same show companies like Toyota claimed they were going hybrid for every line and GM was saying “we need a new Hummer”!!!
PPS – BUT DO NOT BLAME JUST the auto companies. In the 1980’s oil companies quit buying ALL FORDS when a less than 50 cent part doubled the motor oil life (JUST MOTOR OIL) – that cost Ford billions and certainly slowed them from improving gas mileage. I could go on with more inside stories (like the first Camry dissected at Ford, GM’s excellent robotics that sold to all but the “Big 3”, Ralph Nader ensured we only had big cars,…) but I’ve overstayed my welcome with too many words already.
A Hybrid Mini-Van is the ideal vehicle for my Family, I would buy it without hesitation.
Why does it take so long for the manufactures to see what is wanted and needed for consumers, is it the "Forest & Tree " syndrome.
Ken
We want the hybrid mini-van! We want the hybrid mini-van! We want the hybrid mini-van! We want the hybrid mini-van! We want the hybrid mini-van! We want the hybrid mini-van!
Chrysler's making noises about a PHEV minivan. If you want to further push them to actually make one, I highly recommend you call their customer care line at:
1-800-992-1997
Chrysler LLC Customer Assistance Center
P.O. Box 21-8004
Auburn Hills, MI 48321-8004
Telephone Number
I always lease minivans since I am waiting for hybrid model to come out. My lease is ending this December. I hope one will be coming by then so I can stop leasing and buy a hybrid minivan.
We too are waiting to for hybrid minivan. We won't buy a new car until a hybrid minivan comes out!
When????? I'm hanging in there, but WHEN???
Isn't chrysler working on something like that? I think they might have a plug in electric.
A Diesel Honda Oddesey is coming out next year for 2010
I still want a Toyota
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