Gas Engine Kicking In on Start-Up
Created July 3, 2007, at 1:31 am by ms1388
I just bought my NAH two weeks ago and I was struggling to get 25 MPG until I finally did some freeway driving this weekend (my commute is about 3 miles each way) and got it up around 34. Anyway, I noticed that first thing in the morning (and when I leave work)--in other words, after the car has been idle for an extended period of time--the gas engine kicks in almost immediately when I start the car. I get a few seconds of EV Mode and then the gas engine kicks in, even if I am still in park and haven't moved yet. Is that normal? Service guy at the dealership says that it is not normal, and that the battery should hold the charge overnight. Told me to bring it in, which I am doing tomorrow, but of course I would like to avoid that if I can. Let me know if your NAH does what I am describing.
Thanks.
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2 years ago
I think it's normal for the engine to start every time you start the engine "cold". It does this to heat the catalytic converter and O2 sensors and get the emission system up to normal operating temperatures. I don't think it's dependent on the battery charge although the colder the temperature the more likely the battery would be at a diminished output. A hybrid is, after all, mainly a gas vehicle with an electrical assist.
A real killer for fuel economy, just like a non-hybrid car - is a lot of short trips where the engine cools down between them plus the AC in a hybrid also seems to take its toll as well.
I've got a 20-40 mile commute (depends on the carpool) and I've averaging just over 39 mpg.
2 years ago
you also want to have about 30 seconds of the oil pump running to help lubricate the vital engine parts
so yes, it's normal and it's bad if it doesn't.
short trips completely kill your fuel economy due to the start up/warm up
2 years ago
Thanks for the input. I brought it in today and showed the service guy your posts, and sure enough, he checked around and you are indeed correct--what my car is doing is normal. Turns out, the guy I spoke to had just come over from a Toyota dealership, and he was used to the Prius and how it works. Even though it is the same technology, apparently the way the technology is used in the Altima is different than the way it is used in the Prius. So even he got a little education.
Unfortunately, I was just starting to recognize the point made in the last post--that the fact that I have a 3-mile commute is counterproductive to my getting great gas mileage with this car. I guess I would have been better off with the Prius, but I don't really like the body style. Live and learn.
Thanks for the advice, though--at least I know there's nothing wrong with my car.
2 years ago
I'm curious how the Prius would be different on a cold start up. I would think that it would also need to start the engine to warm up the emission system.
Does the Prius go to the EV mode even when cold and for how long?
2 years ago
Don't know. I'm just assuming from what he said about having come over from Toyota.
2 years ago
I have a Prius. It is totally normal for the ICE to kick on right after you start up the car. It has to warm up the catalytic converter. The engine coolant DOESN'T have to get warmed up, though, since these cars stash the coolant away in a thermos bottle when you shut down the car (you'll hear a distinctive humming sound for a couple of seconds after you turn off the car). In the heat down here in the summer (Raleigh) it does take less time for this to happen than in the winter.
I notice the same thing about short trips. The mileage really is awful for the first 5 minutes or so (25 mpg or less). Once you're on the road for 10 minutes or so the mileage will go up. A hypermiler trick (which works on non-hybrid cars, too) is to combine your errands into a single trip, and start with the most distant destination first. Then, on the shorter legs coming back home, you'll get better mileage with your car already mostly warmed up.
2 years ago
The Prius actually has a resevoir of hot water stored in it that flows through the engine when started. The water storage system can maintain the water temp above 85 degrees for 3 days.
2 years ago
Wow - throw in a bucket of fried chicken and you could have a picnic.
Does the Camy have the same set up? If so I wonder why the Nissan engineers didn't include this feature.
2 years ago
Not only does it run the ICE to heat the Cat I have noticed that after the Blue water temp light goes out it still will not go EV for about another 4 to 5 minutes.
2 years ago
really? mine goes into EV mode even before the blue light turns off
2 years ago
Let me tell the story as accurately as i can as i am interested in your analysis.
1. Start Car
2. Back out of garage Ice ture on by the time the front end is out of garage door.
3. I drive off and try to let everything settle for a couple of miles.
4. I try to get to 25 or so and suddenly release the gas it does not go into EV mode this is the way it stay for at least 10 miles or about 5 minutes then it will go into EV, the Blue light has been off for a long time by then.
5. Added Info: Even after driving 30 minutes I really cannot take off slowely enough to stay in EV mode I get it rolling and accellerate slower than I can walk by the time I get to 25 mph it flips on the ICE. Even after driving for an hour and a half the situation is stll the same.
6. I am half way thru my second tank and have deriven it for distances on 90 miles on the freeway, Done everyknid of driving I can think of pulse and glide, etc. Everything but drop it off a cliff and i cant get the metter to show more than 31.5 mpg max. I am running the AC bu on recirculate, set at 79 to 81 vents aimed at me to stand the heat. Press the AC of at lights you name it. I think I git a drunk the way it gussles gas. The tires are at 45psi.
Any thoughts?
2 years ago
my thoughts are...don't have your maximum rated @ 40 PSI tires at 45 PSI for one thing
i think that even if you keep the AC on at 79, it will still run the compressor and kill some fuel economy
try resetting your MPG computer...maybe the bad start is killing your computer now. mileage does get better though
2 years ago
I find that the AC on or off doesn't matter since it is run by electric and won't affect fuel economy since the compessor doesn't drag off of the ICE as in "normal" cars. On level surfaces with battery well charged I can go from stop to 40 mph without ICE kicking in and travel approx. 3 miles on EV mode. In cases where the is a slight incline, from stop I will give more pedal and start ICE until I get to 30 or so and then back off and EV for long distances. It really takes time and practice to get it working well. My mileage was stuck around 33.5 until I changed my highway driving somewhat (keeping at no more than 65 except for downhills keeping mileage bar above 40 and let it slow up hills trying to maintain 40ish MPG and now am averaging 37 MPG. That is about as much that I think I can get out of her.
2 years ago
The AC penalty in a hybrid comes from the electric compressor drawing down your battery faster than when it's not running. The ICE has to start more often to compensate.
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