’06 Prius vs. ’06 Civic Hybrid – help!

"second, it's a prius. it's like the vw bug of today..."

Thanks, I think articulates what I have been thinking about the Prius as well.

Still, I LOVE the HCH interior. Very cool...

err, someone emailed me but my mail screwed up. anyway, the vehicle stability control is one of the big selling points on the prius for me. it's pretty ridiculous that honda offers neither that nor traction control on the civic. it's a simple feature. the handling is supposed to be better on the civic as a whole as in taking curves and such (it outperformed the prius on the slalom and had better braking distance by 8ft), but the prius has those stability and traction controls to make the ride safer. again, both have their merits. I agree with what edmunds.com's InsideLine said, "the strength of the civic shows how great the prius really is." (or something along those lines, i can't find the article at the moment). the more research i did on the civic finding out how great it is, the more i fell in love with the prius. it's as if all the things they praised in the civic, the prius already did it.

Howdy all,

It will come down to a matter of driving feel to most. For me, I have always tended to like the sportier better handling feel of Hondas over Toyotas although I admit both are great car companies and I am a shareholder in both. Interestingly enough, I found myself after looking at the 2006 HCH leaning "on spec" toward the Prius over the HCH because it had a fold-down rear seat, had electronic stability control (i.e., anti-skid which I agree is important), better mileage per spec but less for me since they are both comparable for highway miles on spec, better tax credit, etc. That all changed when I test drove the Prius.

My comments:

- I agree the HCH drives _much_ better than the uninspiring Prius and continues to reinforce my experience about the difference between Honda and Toyotas above.

- The Prius mileage I saw during a city test drive was very erratic and looked maybe in the low to mid 40s tops compared to the suggested spec of 60. Not sure what was going on there when the type of driving I was doing should have been right up the Prius' alley.

- I am tall and also have generally found the Honda's fit taller people better. I am 6'4" and the first thing I noticed sitting in the Prius was that I was staring at the top tinted portion of the front windshield. When I reached for the height adjustment which I would expect on a $28k vehicle it was nowhere to be found. I hope they added this in the 2006 since I test drove a 2005. This is not just the Prius. Go sit in the new Sienna vs. the new Odyssey. I adjusted the Sienna as low as it could go and as far back as it would go and still I got too nice a view of the tinted window at the top of the windshield. Overall, the HCH seems to have a better driving position for taller drivers.

- 100% agree with limited visibility out the back of the vehicle. I am an engineer by trade and a detail-oriented person and I did not like this limited rear view. People focus (even myself) sometimes too much on the fancy safety features like ESC (anti-skid) when something simple like limited visibility can cause just as many or more near-miss situations.

- I also am a big believer in looking at the Total Cost of Ownership of a vehicle and I think in one way the HCH will have the edge here. Why? Go read about how the Prius shares very little parts with other car models and that adds up to potentially more expensive replacement parts down the road unlike the HCH which shares a lot with its conventional cousin. IMHO Honda is making the smarter move here because it will help TCO and likely lowers their transition costs to a full hybrid line-up.

- I agree with the interior and exterior styling comments made by others about the HCH vs. the Prius. The HCH is nicer, simpler, and will hold the test of time IMHO better than the too techno-weenie-ish design of the Prius. The Prius to me screams "I bought a hybrid vehicle and I want everyone to know about it." The best compliment I think the HCH gets is one people don't think of as a compliment, that is that it is hard to tell from its conventional cousin unless one has a trained eye. Toyota agrees mostly because the hybrid Highlander and Camry versions do not and will not look as out-there as the Prius. 5 years from now hybrid technology will be valued as something that just works underneath without the consumer knowing that it is there other than higher gas mileage and lower emissions.

- the HCH has active/dynamic headrests that I do not believe the Prius has which significantly improves rear crash test results over the Prius if it will not have them.

So, which way am I leaning after the above? Believe it or not neither toward the HCH or the Prius but toward either the 2006 Accord Hybrid which is one nice ride since I test drove the 2005 HAH or the 2006 (or 2007 in 2006) Camry hybrid. The only thing the 2006 HAH lacks that I wanted is a fold-down rear seat. Everything else is there and more and I decided that I don't need super-awesome gas mileage and would be content to match my 1993 Civic that gets around 40 on the hwy.

So, I just want to wait to see the specs on the Camry hybrid before making a decision but since Toyota and Honda may both sell out of their 2006 tax credits by the 2nd or 2rd quarter of 2006, I may have to go with the 2006 HAH if I want the credit because with the likely wait lists on the Hybrid Camry I may not get one in time to get the full credit even though it is projected to be more than HAH by like $500 or so.

Hope this helps.

Just a few more points.... HCH comes with 6 air bags standard.Toyota Prius comes with I believe 2 airbags standard. There are other safety features on the new '06 HCH unique to Honda Civics. As a result the Civic recently received the gold award from the National Insurance Institute for Highway Safety (the only vehicle in the small car class to do so).
The Civic has a decent (by hybrid standards) size trunk while the Prius has a very limited space in the back. I realize that you can fold one of the seats down in the Prius, but that will significantly reduce the interior space. I don't know if it is a consideration for you, but it may be nice to have an option of hiding whatever you are carrying in the trunk out of sight if you are in the city.

The one thing that really convinced me was the blind spot; in the Prius, it is huge. I live in the Washington, DC metro and I deal with a lot of traffic going to work. With cars tail gating each other, a large blind spot could mean miss seeing a car that has changed lanes into the Prius' blind spot.

As far as traction control is concerned, I have never had a car that had it. I have never had the need for it. I have never been in an accident on the road where ice/snow/rain was the problem. I would also consider it more of a problem. What happens when you get use to having it and then you get into a car that doesn't have it? I would think you are likely to panic and over react. I would also think people are more likely to drive more recklessly in a car that has it because they think it will allow them to do things.

I have also read some people's concern over trunk space. According to edmunds.com, the civic has 10 cu feet of space and the Prius has 60% more (16 cu ft). That is nice but I have friends with a trucks for my large hauling needs.

I really like the safety features of the HCH. It has turn signals on the mirrors, 6 standard air bags, and day time running lights.

From what I have read, the HCH has the lowest total cost of ownership. The insurance and maintenace is less.

Being that the HCH has a lot of parts that carry over from the normal civic, parts are easier to find too. I have heard that the Prius has parts that can only be purchased through Toyota. For instance, I heard the tires on the Prius are specific and only Toyota sells them (which they sell at a premium). Perhaps someone with a Pruis could tell us for sure....

As far as price goes, I am using my Costco membership to get a DISCOUNTED price on the vehicle. So if you aren't a member, it may be worth the membership fee to you. I have the executive membership but you may be able to use the $40 membership. Check with them to find out for certain.

In my opinion, the HCH fits my needs for a vehicle and provides me with the best value.

Costco is the non-evil version of Wal-Mart, but that's for a whole 'nother message thread...

Anyway, what kind of discount are you getting? I only checked the Costco Auto program with the Prius (I think at the time the HCH wasn't out yet) and they just said, we won't charge over MSRP. How much of a discount are you getting on the HCH? Also, what area are you in (I'm in the Southeast).

Check the Price Pulse feature of this site. As for me, the best I've been able to find in the Southeast region is MSRP. The supply is so low on these vehicles that any demand at all allows them to charge MSRP or higher.

The Prius has better mileage, power, utility, and safety than the Civic.

48MPG vs 46 MPG real world data:
http://www.greenhybrid.com/compare/mileage/

0-60mph: 10.9s vs 12.4s
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/Comparos/articleId=108445/pageId=67422

The Prius has a 60/40 fold down rear seat, providing a ton of cargo hauling space. The Civic's rear seat does not fold down at all.

The Prius is available with all of the airbags that the Civic is available with, plus it can be had with stability control, which has been shown in multiple studies to reduce accident rates. Saying you don't need stability control because you don't use it much is like saying you don't need airbags because you don't use them much.
http://www.esceducation.org/what_experts_say/industry_reports.shtml

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I initially didn't like the way the Prius looks because it was so different. Then I realized that different can be good. Now I love the way it looks. To generalize sweepingly, people who like to blend in will like the Civic, and people who like to stand out will like the Prius. To each his own.

First off, awesome responses guys.

I am also one of the hundreds (or thousands) of people debating whether to get the Prius or HCH.

My 2 cents: Each car has their own distinct advantages and disadvantages, one just needs to figure out which one he/she prefers.

Also, beauty is only superficial. Also, sometimes the question "aesthetics vs. functionality/options" comes to mind.

I am leaning more with the Prius because of the hatchback and bluetooth capability.. on the other hand, I think the HCH is much better looking..

What do you guys think?

Edmunds has a comparison test, and the Prius won. They say, and I agree, that the Civic Hybrid may work better for some people, it's all down to personal preference. I prefer the better performance, better mileage, larger interior, larger trunk plus the flexibility of the hatchback and folding rear seats of the Prius when compared to the Civic. Having read the comparo, not yet driven the Civic, I like the idea of the slightly crisper handling, but that's about the only advantage that I see for the Civic, other than the fact that not everyone likes the Prius's looks, whether it be exterior, interior, or both. The Civic may not suit everyone's idea of good-looking, either, though.... The Civic's IMA system is improved a lot, but it still is not up there with Prius's Hybrid Synergy Drive, with 20 hp electric motor instead of 76 on Prius - plus the torque difference is substantial, though combined horsepower of both cars is 110, the Prius kicks the Civic's rear in acceleration (this is what torque does). The Civic can run under "electric only" (between something like 5 and 20 mph only, and for VERY short distances) plus the engine turns off (and the Air Conditioning now is electric and stays on when the engine turns off, as the Prius already did) - but the Civic, when it runs on "electric only" mode is still turning over the gasoline engine - without gasoline - wasteful and just a gimick so that Honda can say their car can run under electric-only mode, in my humble opinion.

"I would imagine I would purchase the extended warranty on either car which would cover important things until 5 yrs."

This will do you about as much good as making a pile of $100 bills, pouring gas on them, and setting them afire. Extended warranties are a waste of money for the average car, and a terrible blunder in the case of the two most reliable brands on the planet.

A word about options. I would never again buy another car without stability control. Please keep in mind that this is NOT traction control, altough traction control is one function it does fulfill.

How it works, more or less, is through the ABS braking system, coupled to accelerometers and steering angle sensors. If the car starts to slide, it anticipates if the car is under or oversteering, and applies differential braking to correct the slide. I've hit solid sheet black ice where the median and ditches looked like parking lots, just about every vehicle went off the road. It kept me on the road.

It is one option I will never live without. Maybe in Phoenix you don't need it. But anywhere that rains or snows? To me it doing without stability control makes as much sense as cutting out the seatbelts.

I have it on my Passat TDI and it is awesome. That would heavily weigh in my car purchase decision.

For those who would like to read about the civic's saftey rating:

http://www.hondanews.com/CatID2001

Sorry but toyota didn't have anything about the Prius

http://www.toyota.com/about/news/

I am among those torn between the two. I love that the Prius has folding rear seats and has traction and stability control. I also am one of the few who like the exterior just as much as the Civic. The one thing that has me leaning toward the Civic however is that I love the interior of the new '06 and really don't like the interior of the Prius. However, I can get better tax credits for the Prius ($6,435 which includes both the Federal credit and the Colorado State credit). The Civic will only have about $5,000 in combined credits. Anyone out there who has bought a Prius and "learned" to like the Prius interior?

I finally put a deposit down on the Prius. Here's why:

1) It's the third year of this model, as opposed to the first of the Civic. Though the Civic has the "new" appeal, historically it won't be as reliable since it's the first year of a new model. Of course, both companies are reliable as a whole, so there may not be too large of a difference anyways.

2) I was able to take the Prius overnight for a test drive. I could not even take the Civic for an hour or unsupervised. I know this has nothing to do with the vehicle itself.

3) The Smart Key System is really appealing. I know it's just an accessory, but it is still amazing. I mean, air conditioning is just an accessory, too.

4) The size of the two vehicles was a big factor. I consider the Prius a mid-size sedan, while the Civic is still a compact. I don't want to go down in size from the vehicle I currently drive (94 Maxima).

5) It's a Prius. Twenty years from now, I could say, "I drove one of the first Priuses." A Civic just doesn't hold that claim.

6) The Civic Hybrid isn't too much better off than a cheaper Civic EX or something. I'd rather wait till they bring the price down (and get some more damn colors). I can easily see a Civic Hybrid being my next vehicle. I've always favored Honda over Toyota.

7) Vehicle stability control, traction control, smart key system, cup holders in the back, fold down rear seats

I'm sure there are more, and if the Civic had had some of the features I mentioned above (stability and traction, 60/40 seats, another year under its belt, better colors) I probably would've gotten the Civic instead. So, wish me luck - my Silver, package #4 Prius is slated to come in on January 18!

At this stage, it is about 60% Prius & 40% HCH. Honda would be very pleased if the 06 HCH would hold this ratio in actaul sales against the 06 Prius.

I bought my prius option 4 for 27k flat about $100 below final price (negotiated). I've been very happy with the keyless remote entry system and i'm averaging 53 mpg on flat drives but i get over 68 mpg on high to low elevation drives, AMAZING! For low to high it is around 44mpg, still not too shabby. Don't have to change the oil very often, only every 5000 miles and the oil filter is easily reachable to change as well so i do it myself. No need to take it into the dealership. Just make sure you use 5W-30 oil. I was interested in the HCH but after reading about it and owning a prius, forget about honda until their hybrids can drive solely on electric power at 15-20 mph or below. Prius is damn ugly but seems safe and kicks ass in every geeky way possible. I'm saving up for a second prius but am wondering if i should wait till 2007 for an upgrade because 2006 prius is unchanged from 2005. Also, i can't wait to get 100+ mpg by upgrading using the kit from http://www.edrivesystems.com coming in 2006 sometime.

I owned a 2003 Honda Accord for the last couple of years and found it very noisy inside.

I traded my Accord in for a Prius and am very happy.

I drive an 05 Prius and a 04 Hummer H2. I find them pretty similar. Hah, just kidding. Interesting perspective, Saurbh. I've heard other people (or maybe these were all your quotes) comparing the experience of driving their elite luxury sports cars to driving the Prius. I think the biggest factor is that they are both so cutting edge. They are at the very pinnacle of their category. Cars like the Camry, the Accord, the Malibu, they are all just "cars". But the Porshe carries with it an image, an ideal. The same is true with the Prius. Very unique driving experiences are to be expected, and a lot is built around these vehicles. Both are ice breakers that stir up conversation and even debate.

Alex (and anybody else considering the Navigation package on any car): See my January 31 2005 blog report at http://www.hybridcars.com/blogs/bloglist.php?thread_id=7&month=1&year=2005 re: my $100 GPSD navigation system which is better (In My Humble Opinion) than any built-in navigation system on the market. (Of course, it also separately requires a laptop...) See http://www.delorme.com to get started.

I thought I'd be buying the Prius, which I think is beautiful. Then yesterday I test-drove it. It just didn't give me the feeling of oneness-with-car-and-road that I like for the wintry, hilly, non-city Vermont driving I do. The ergos were not great for me either.

Then I drove the 2006 HCH and loved it! But is it enough better for the environment than the Civic EX to make it worthwhile? Should I just get the 2006 EX, stash the extra dough, and wait for a stronger electric engine before jumping to hybrid?

I'm still mourning the fact that I didn't love driving the Prius, and I hate the tiny joystick that sets the driving gear. Ugh, what to do?

The Civic Hybrid or the Civic EX? That's the dilemma for me. (Maybe I should have put it under a different topic heading.)

I give frequently and joyfully to animal and environmental organizations. Stashing a bit just means some investment income later so I can give even more. :-)

Alex, thanks for your input. I'm leaning toward the hybrid and I readily admit it's mostly emotional.

Do you know if the 2006 tax credit on hybrids is income-based? Do you have any details or references on that?

Here's the link that explains the tax credit fairly well.

http://taxes.about.com/od/deductionscredits/a/hybridtaxcredit.htm

The HCH credit is $2100.
The Prius credit is $3150.

We're getting the HCH, after careful review and numerous test drives for both cars. I actually prefer the Prius a bit and that's because of the keyless entry. But today, my wife test drove the HCH for the first time, 2 days ago she test drove a Prius package #8. When she got in the HCH, she said she felt at home and in a car that she could be comfortable in. She didn't get that feeling in the Prius. Also she loved the visiblility in the rear of the HCH, she complained a lot about the visibility out the back of the Prius. I liked the Prius because of all the options, HID, VSC, leather etc. but the wife says that driving the HCH just feels so natural and handles much better than the Prius. She feels like she's in a tin box/can in the Prius. I told her the Prius is faster in acceleration than the HCH but she just loved how it handles, especially today when it rained in Los Angeles.

We're off to buy a HCH, just can't decide on color yet. Either the Magnetic Grey or White but she doesn't like the Ivory interior of the White and prefers the blue interior.

I just drove a 2006 HCH, and it was nice. However it seems the ICE come on when you let off the brake and doesn't really run in electric only. I believe the ICE comes on in most other hybrids when it is needed or when a mph is reached. Is this correct?

Correction: In the post above I meant to say "my final chapter". I didn't intend to end the discussion - as if I had a choice anyway :)

I feel I have died and gone to hybrid heaven....

Regarding the above mentioned tax credit for the Honda Civic Hybrid. The $2,100 federal tax credit is the credit level for the 2005 model. The 2006 model has been completely redesigned and the credit level has not yet been estimated that I have seen on the internet. Hopefully it will be higher than the 2005 credit, as the 2006 does have higher EPA numbers.

I haven't driven the '06 Civic yet but we almost bought a Prius last year. Here's why we did not, and will, not buy the Prius even if it is a nice car:
-- the blind spot at the passenger rear corner precluded backing out of a parking spot and would be dangerous if the passenger side mirror was ever damaged.
--the steering wheel was too far forward.
--the mileage figures are more inflated than we can accept. 60 mpg? When elephants fly! No one we know gets over 50.
--but most of all...our local dealer would have made an ACLU lawyer look honest. He tried evey imaginable (and amusing) way of gouging us, including trying to sell a well-used vehicle for $28 grand firm, telling us that he was offering a Prius at $1000 over book value for only $31K, and telling us that he could get us an employee-discounted (and bare-bones) vehicle for just $29K. We will not subsidize greed and we will not subsidize dishonesty. In all fairness, he did not have a cheap plaid sporstsjacket with pointy shoes and he did not wave a cigar at us. At the same time our local Honda dealer offered us a vehicle at $500 below MSRP (we wanted to wait until the new Civic came out). I think we will keep driving our 28 mpg car until something more revolutionary comes along.

Just bought a Silver Pine Mica, Beige interior, Package #8.

Didn't go with the HCH as originally planned because of practicality, we need the hatchback room. Plain and simple. We loved the drive of the HCH by far because it feels like a normal car but the Prius room is needed just in case of some babies coming our way.

It was a long day for me, went to Frontier Toyota in Valencia. I went there and wanted to buy there because it's close to where my wife works and she could easily go there for service. Well, they kept changing the price on me and the finance rate. Would not take my ELOAN check, saying it was unreliable and all that BS that follows. They offered me 5.9% since my ELOAN was at 5.35. I refused to go higher than what I got but with the 5.9%, I could take advantage of the $400 graduate incentive and it evens out. I walked out on them the day before because they wouldn't honor the ELOAN but I came back since they promise no more BS and again they are near my wife's work. So we get there at 8am, now they say that the 5.9% was never mentioned and they still won't take the ELOAN check. What the heck? So now we threathen to leave and get the 5.9% again. The problem was not my salesman Diego but the closer Sean, older guy, green eyes or at least they weren't brown. Anyway this guy is a total jerk, the day before and even now. He tries to be nice in the beginning. Keeps insisting I write them the deposit check before meeting the finance guy. I refused because then they have me. So now he gets a bit of an attitude. He asks if I'm going to buy accessories, I say no. The salesman and I agreed on price and he said I had to buy nothing. So now he agrees but I have to refuse the items to the finance guy which is fine by me. But before he leaves, he again gives a bad attitude. This is the same guy that lied to me so many times before. I get sick of his crap and just walked out without saying a word. They knew I was pissed at that guy and I asked the salesman to not have him there in the morning when I came but he was there.

Stay away from Frontier Toyota in Valcencia unless you want crap from them or at least maybe avoid the closer Sean. I really wanted to buy the car there and they just made it so hard on me for no reason. Poor sales guy was so pissed at the closer because he was begging me for 2 days to come back in and I finally did and he lost the sale again last minute because of Sean's attitude. Avoid at all cost. Besides that the cars inside was all muddy, they didn't bother to put something down on the floor for test drives. The rear was really muddy and needed water vacumning.

Then I get a call right after I leave from Carson Toyota, the guy says the price is $1000 over MSRP and I balk, calls me back and says that he'll sell for sticker, I tell him I'll come in late night. I go there and met a different salesman. I tell him that I won't take anymore crap and just keep me away from the annoying people and he'll have a sale. He says he'll try. The closer comes says Carson Toyota usually sells the car for $6000 over and for a good price right now will give it to me for $2500. I'm like what the hell didn't they quote me sticker. So apparently, the manager on duty didn't want to sell below $2500 and they were willing to let us walk apparently. Anyway, they ask me who quoted me the sticker price and I told them the name of the original salesman that called that morning. He confirmed with the morning manager and they agree on sticker.

The best rate they offered me there was 5.95, they also tried to crazy crap on me at first where they added $2500 to the sticker and made the loan a 72 month loan, to make the monthly seem lower. I asked him if people are stupid enough to fall for this kind of BS and we all get a good laugh. So now he offers 5.95% which I would of taken since the Grad Incentive evens out the difference but I was weary of being mislead, so I said I would just use my ELOAN check which they said was fine.

So I go to finance, it's real late at this point before closing at 10pm so I guess he's tired so I ask him about the 5.95% and he says they were wrong, it was 6.9%, my guess is he just wanted to leave so didn't want to do the paper work and would rather just take my ELOAN check at that point. So it was better for me. He didn't ask me to buy the extended warranty and no push at all, just said if I wanted to add anything in general and I said no. My guess is that this guy if I came in the afternoon he would of did the whole extended warranty speel and the rest of the finance dance to get me to finance with them. But I could tell he was tired and just wanted to bail. I did ask him the price of the 7y/100k and he wanted $1895 or so and $2200 if I bought later. Double of what's offered here.

I check over the paperwork for fishing things. I bought an Accord a couple of years back and the fiance guy tried to sneak in a $800 window etching without saying anything. At this point it became a cash deal since there was no financing, so I didn't have to bust out the laptop with the finance program. That way I could match up the monthly payment and make sure they weren't inserting any unnecessary things. A calulator and some double checking. My break down is:

From Carson Toyota
$29524, package #8, Z1 package and bumper aplique, 2 PIOs.
$45 doc fee, max allowed in CA.
$2439.44 8.25% sales tax
$253 licencse fee
$8.75 tire fee.

So total out the door is $32270.19, finance a little more than half from ELOAN at 5.35% through Sam's Club for the cheaper rate than the normal ELOAN rate.

I'll add that Frontier Toyota had a BS electronic registration fee of $30 or so which I'm glad Carson did not. They claim you get the plates faster, who give a crap about that, I'd rather save my $30.

My salesguy Henry was a good guy, very calm the whole time. I was a bit miffed at him for letting the closer go at me but I guess that's his job but I was an inch from walking out again when they pulled the $2500 over sticker and that 72 month finance rate. But my wife said to hear them out and it worked out.

So Carson does not sell for MSRP unless you get to them to agree to it before you get there. Obviously the salesguy wants to sell at sticker because he wants his commish but the manager has to be in the right mood or maybe they need a quota to meet during his shift.

So here's where I went, Frontier which I highly don't recommend. Hamar Toyota in Mission Hills, 118, 405 area. They want $1500 extra for the chrome wheels. La Crescenta is $2000 over MSRP. Both Hamar and La Cresenta have a couple of cars since nobody will buy it over MSRP, you can try your luck though, just like me you might walk in when the moons align up right and they decide to be reasonable or can't wait for a real sucker to come in and pay over MSRP.

North Hollywood Toyota had a silver #8, MSRP, I think they promised on the radio to only charge MSRP. Glendale Toyota had a Seaside Pearl #8 at MSRP. Santa Monica had Seaside #8 not MSRP. Long Beach Toyota had a white #8 at MSRP. This is what I remember for now, they had a bunch of cars at the dealers I went to so there is no shortage but they won't go below MSRP, but you can always try. I would and did.

I just wanted to correct one thing from the FAQ list that is misleading.

The Prius is rated at a peak output of 67hp electric motor - but if you check Toyota.com you will see that it only delivers a power output 28 hp (21 kW) in reality - because that is the max' output of the batteries to the motor.

The total net power delivered by the Hybrid System is 110 hp (82 kW). And therefore the HCH has more power available overall.

When I test-drove the Prius it definately felt very "American" in performance - somewhat spongy and boaty - that is why I opted for the 2005 HCH with manual - much more pep and driver control and European style handling.

I only wish Honda would offer the HCH 06 with a manual option next year as well as the CVT. After
all the regular Civic 06 comes with manual standard.

the Prius electric motor provides 295 lbs-ft of torque, much more powerful than the Civic Hybrid's electric motor, or most gasoline engines.

Had my Prius since April and never regretted a minute of owning it. There is no blind spot if you set your mirrors according to the AAA method.

I've had my Prius since early August when the price of gas started its upward spiral. Had heard about the Prius and I was told that people who owned a Prius loved it. I went to the dealer to just inquire, but there on the lot sat a 2005 White Prius. I test drove it, then took it to show my wife and she drove it. Within 2 hours I owned it and received it the following day.

I have never regretted that purchase. Both my wife and I love it. I have a Yukon SUV (right, I own one of those SUVs that some people dare to hate, which I might add gets 18 mpg on a trip and better mileage than a couple foreign small cars that I have had in the 70s.) that I use to pull my trailer that I love also. However, I have not figured out a way that I can drive both at the same time. I love the navigation system, the handling characteristics of the car, the ability to mountain climb (Trip from SE Pennsylvania to Corning, New York took me up over the Ridge and Valley Section of PA to the Appalachian Plateau of Northern PA. I set the cruise at 70 mph, and there was never any hesitation with gas mileage running 49-50 mpg. I had 534 miles on that tank of gas and didn't need to fill up until I got home.

I really love that car and driving it is a pleasure. The only 2 items that I wish that it had was 1. daylight running lights. 2. rear backup camera as the screen is already there and it sure is a safety feature. The 2006 has the daylight running lights so there is only one more to go.

A month after our purchase, we found out that two of our friends now have the Prius. They ordered theirs and had to wait. I considered myself very lucky. That White Prius was just waiting for me!

I bought a 2006 Pkg#8 Prius on the first business day of this year, for all the reasons most people buy Priuses for.

After having the car a few days, I have to share something with anyone on the fence about this vehicle:

I'd buy this Prius again, even if it were not a hybrid, even if it didn't get 50 miles per gallon, even if there were not tax credits, and even if there was no HOV lane access.

The smart key system, the navigation, the information display, the spacious interior, the hatchback design... it's just a great vehicle.

In California, a Prius does not stand out. They are everywhere, and then some.

We've got an 06 #5 on order (so they tell me). We tried my wife's Cello case (sans Cello) in the hatch and could not get it to lie flat w/o dropping one of the seats. Also, with the Cello inside, the positioning required to get the case in the back ends up being a back killer (yes, middle aged) and puts too much stress on the cello case neck.

Anyone out there with the trick to share? And yes, my wife thinks a soft case might work

I have an 05 Prius and it is quite simply the best overall car that I have ever owned. Zero problems coupled with great unique innovations make it a pleasure to drive. Oddly enough, keyless operation is the most convenient aspect as my keys have always been in the "wrong" pocket. My son took his drivers test in the Prius and the tester took all of the time checking out the car.

Don,
I'm a violinist, and I carpool often to jobs with a double-bass player who bought the Prius. We carpool all the time together, and besides the two of us, he fits the string bass in the car just fine (neck comes up betwteen us two passengers).
Of course I just bought an 06 HCH... I like the car better, but with the HCH being a sedan without fold-down seats (as opposed to a hatchback) there's no way you could fit a bass inside. As far as a cello.. maybe across the back seat.
If you have large things to tote, the Prius might be the way to go, but for what it's worth, even after months of carpooling in my colleague's Prius, I (as a violinist) decided on the 06 HCH. Why? Because even though there's plenty of leg room length-wise in the Prius, the left-hand arm rest for the driver (where all the window controls are) sticks out and always hits me right where my knees are. I can keep my knees straight, but have no room to "strech out" sideways. The HCH is much better engineered in that the arm rest angles up, giving anyone's knees plenty of clearance to go all the way to the door, instead of always having to be pressed against the hard-plastic control panel on the Prius.
The Prius is a good car. If it wasn't for this I would have considered it, but considering the amount of time I spend on the road, I want to be comfortable, and in that regard (for me anyway) there's no comparison... the HCH is much more comfortable and roomy. Of course it doesn't have some of the hi-tech features the Prius does, but... I'd rather be comfortable (and it rides great). But if you want to tote a cello around, you might have to get the Prius.

I read every month my second Bible which is Consumer Reports, and I recomend you to read the most recent, the February Issue. Honda Civic recomended # 1 in all three categories: Manual transmission, EX automatic, and Hybrid. Toyota Prius is # 9.
Sooooo....., clear choice after reading the MOST unbiased magazine in the USA. Hope that you decide accordingly; Good luck....!!!!

When I saw and read about the second-generation 2004 Prius, I knew immediately it would be the perfect replacement for my wife's car. This year, motivated by the new tax credits, I decided to replace my beloved 1999 Jetta with a hybrid. I was very open to the Honda Civic Hybrid and test-drove it a few days ago, thinking that the Civic's handling might be at least halfway between that of the Jetta (in which I've avoided many accidents through quick maneuvering) and the Prius.

Yes, the HCH handles better and has a more comfortable and convenient interior than the Prius. In the end, however, the Prius got my vote. The HCH's better handling was not significant enough to outweigh the Prius's many features, the higher tax credit, and the superior quality of the Toyota dealership in Manassas, Virginia.

And so I eagerly await the arrival of my 2006 Prius with Package 6 in February. I'll miss the handling of my Jetta, but I'll just have to learn to drive more conservatively -- until the Germans give us a clean turbodiesel hybrid :-)

I have a 05 Civic Hybrid, my wife just bought the 06 Prius. Both have positives, it would be nice to take those positives and make one great car out of them. Having driven both, I have no real preference of one over the other. Pricing was pretty close. The biggest benefit to the Prius is the $3600 tax credit this year. Took delivery 1/7 so hopefully we will get it.

I, like many here, am deciding between a 2006 Prius and 2006 HCH. I was strongly leaning toward the Prius for many of the reasons cited by the Prius fans; larger cabin, larger trunk, fold down rear, traction control, blue tooth, etc. However, a short test drive is all it took to push the Prius from my mind. The car is an ergonomic nightmare. The seats are flat out uncomfortable – this is coming from a current Corolla owner. The driver seat rides awkwardly high and is very poorly positioned. The rear seats are worse! There is NO headroom in the rear. I am not a tall person (5’10”) but I could not sit comfortably in the rear seat because my head actually hit the roof. Any average sized adult/teenaged male will be forced to lean forward while sitting in the back, which is simply unacceptable. Furthermore, the bar dividing the rear window is a human factors nightmare. I have read many posts regarding the differences in features between the Prius and HCH, but few have addressed the comfort. The Prius is one of the least comfortable cars I have ever experienced. Given the amount of time most of us spend in our cars comfort is not a trivial concern.

Just one comment to Scott C. -- I don't know if on spec the Prius has a larger cabin than the HCH does, but the #1 reason -- in fact the MAIN reason I bought the HCH was because there was a lot more room for the driver in the HCH than the Prius. Especially in the sides. The Prius may be long, but it's very narrow, and no matter how much I tried, I couldn't stand the hard-plastic arm bar (where all the windows and door locks are located). In the Pirus, it's a straight line tnat my knees were constnatly bumping into. In the HCH it angles upwards, giving ones knees plenty of clearance under them for extra room. Others may not mind this, but I do, and it's the one fault I have with Toyota cars (not just the Prius -- the Corolla is the same way, as is the Camry -- though since the Carmy is a lot wider it's more of a moot point. But on the much narrorwer Prius, just be prepared not to be able to do anything with your legs except have them perfectly straight all the time, with that hard plastic bar always in the way).

I'm not dissing the Prius.. as I said in an earlier post I could have easily bought both, but just wanted to point out when I saw your point about the cabin space... for the driver -- at least for me-- the 06 HCH is much roomier and more comfortable. That's the #1 reason I chose the HCH.
Larry

There is no comparison with the Prius...the options, the drive, the comfort, the Prius has it all over the Honda.
We first called around to see who had them in stock,(the car is for my wife), and since it was closest, we went to Longo. After telling me they had "a few", we were put on a waiting list. DO NOT GO TO LONGO!
We then went online to get help...
We were called back the next morning by the Pasadena dealership. The guy told me they had a few come in. I went in, and they actually had 3 of them. The managers name was Michael, and we only dealt with him, until we went to sign paperwork.
There was no BS, and they did not charge over sticker. Anyone wanting a great experience, I suggest go to Symes, through there Internet Dept.

I was also undecided whether to pick up a prius or a civic. Then came our ski trip this weekend. I decided on the prius coz' i'll be able to drive it up to mammoth and i can carry my snowboards and gears with me. I wont be able to do that with a civic without having to install roofracks. I called around and found the color i wanted in the package i wanted (red #3)--how lucky can i be!!!! I'll be getting my prius in about two hours....then drivin' up to mammoth to join my friends there.

Bob-
Don't second guess. The Civic hybrid is a great car. If you want to haul stuff and you don't have a second car (I love my Subaru Forester for that) then it may not be right. Otherwise it handles great, looks great, is very comfortable for anyone under 6'5". The mileage is more than adequate- I am averaging mid 40s in my first month. And to me the most important feature that made me trade in my 2003 Accord for the 2006 Civic hybrid- the Gold safety rating. I used to only get Volvos until other cars finally started catching up in safety features. Happy driving!

I think both Prius and HCH are good cars but they cater to different consumer needs. For me, the choice was clear: '06 HCH with Nav which I bought on 1/2/06.

To me, safety and the feeling of driving a conventional car is paramount. My previous car was a Volvo S80 T6. Due to longer commute as a result of a job change, I needed a hybrid to qualify for the California carpool lane usage. That left me with two choices: Prius and HCH.

Prius is probably more technologically advanced. But the feeling of driving a computer on four wheels didn't appeal to me at all. Besides, transitioning from a Volvo to a compact car is a leap of faith. HCH's "top pick" safety rating which is significantly better than Prius' helped with the transition mentally.

I am sure that Prius is the right car for a lot of people. To me, '06 HCH is the only Hybrid that I will drive to work: it's safe; drives like a conventional car; and qualifies for the carpool lane sticker.

Thanks for the great debate. And congratulations to Seth, the "founder of the thread" on his new Prius. Hope it is brings you many miles of carefree and high mileage pleasure.

I apologize up front because this is going to be a long post, and will cover some things that most of you already know about, but I've got the time if you've got the patience to hear me out.

I picked up my '06 HCH the other day, and am happy with it so far. Tough decision between the HCH and Prius. I really would have liked the anti-skid and traction control. Even though the HCH has excellent safety ratings, I'd rather avoid the accident in the first place. But I've been driving in snow for quite a few years now , winters here have not been so bad lately (global warming? that's why I got a hybird... ), and with front wheel drive and ant-lock, I feel pretty safe.

I agree with the color choices for the HCH also -pretty limited. But colors don't matter much to me so it wasn't part of my decision. I settled on "metallic pearl", which as one post quipped is a shade of gray. Blue interior, I just couldn't see the ivory option - would really be hard to keep clean, I think.

I don't mind the back seat not folding down. 99% of my driving is back and forth to work, and I've got a truck if I need to haul something.

I did get a great price on my HCH, and the dealer had four in stock to choose from, two with and two without Nav. I chose without. Believe it or not, the dealer knocked $1,005 off the sticker as his standard "one low price". Couple this with the $2,150 I'll be getting back from Uncle Sam and I paid about $1,300 below dealer invoice. Not bad. The dealer's name is Lujack Honda (www.lujack.com - but the web site will show MSPR - their standing price w/o Nav. is $21,395). The catch is they are in Davenport, Iowa. Not exactly the most convenient location for most, but if you live in the midwest, it's the best price around that I could find.

One of the earlier posts was wondering why the Prius only seems to get about 2 mpg better than the HCH, at least according to a lot of the info out there. I can speculate, though I can't back it up with many facts, since there don't seem to have been any studies done on it yet.

For both cars, the energy savings come primarily from three sources:

Both have smaller gasoline engines than conventional cars would tend to have. This means less fuel consumption. They make up for the lack of HP by supplementing with a DC electric motor, which has great starting and low-end torque, so the gas engine has a great "helper" at starting and low speeds. Both the HCH and Prius appear to have net horsepower of 110HP, even though the Prius has more HP in the motor and less in the gas engine.

The next thing that helps the gas mileage, of course, is that the engine shuts off at stop lights. Great feature, and saves gas consumption by eliminating idling. Both vehicles do this.

The third feature, and the most overlooked, is regenerative breaking. This is when the motor switches to generating when slowing down and braking, recharging the NiMH battery pack that provides the DC motor it's electricity. Great thing, a DC motor - apply current and it will supply motion and torque. Supply motion and torque and it will supply electricity! Of course there's more to it than that, but that's the basic operation.

Now, when the EPA does it's mileage testing, it is my understanding that a significant part of the "city" mileage is derived while driving the car repeatedly at 20 mph and below. Well, for the Prius this appears to be an advantage, since the gas engine doesn't come on until about 15-20 mph under ideal conditions. So if the EPA is running it for long periods at these speeds, then the batteries would supply a lot of the power, and the regenerative braking would supply a lot of the recharging of the batteries. That would explain the 60mpg city rating from the EPA. Of course the gas engine would come on to charge the batteries when the overall losses caused the batteries to discharge to a certain level. If not, this part of the test would be gasoline free until the batteries died!

But these are not realistic driving conditions. If you drive like this, I feel sorry for you because you are probably on the receiving end of a lot of road rage. But why wouldn't the Prius' "all electric mode" still provide a lot better gas mileage? Well, the batteries get recharged two ways. From regenerative braking, which is free, and from the gas engine turning an alternator, which is definitely not free. In fact, that's a pretty inefficient system. Think about it - the gas engine burns fuel so that it can turn an alternator (or generator, I'm not sure which is used but it doesn't matter), which then charges the batteries, which then supply current to the electric motor which drives the CVT, which turns the wheels. There are a lot of losses in that system. Each individual system from gas engine to the wheels has losses. So recharging the batteries with the engine and then in turn turning the wheels with the DC motor is a lot less efficient than just turning the wheels with the gasoline engine in the first place. And it doesn't matter much whether you turn the wheels partially on all electric, like the Prius, or always with the engine, the batteries still have to be recharged. So under the EPA test, the Prius would have a definite advantage because of all the free regenerative braking and the small use of the gas engine, but under real world conditions the advantages diminish significantly because the power used by the motor to get the vehicle to 15-20 mph has to be recharged using a combination of the gasoline engine and regenerative braking, just like the HCH.

Put another way, I suspect the 60 mpg city rating may not be representative because the batteries may have a significantly lower charge at the end of the test than at the beginning - a fact that the gas engine will eventually have to deal with under normal driving.

There may be facts that I am missing here. If the Prius only lets the batteries discharge a small amount before running the gas engine to bring them back up to a near full charge, then none of this would apply. But that doesn't appear to be how my HCH works, and I doubt the Prius would do it any differently. My batteries could be half discharged and the gas engine wouldn't run any more than if they were fully charged, although I'm sure there is some point, which I haven't seen yet, where the gas engine would not allow the batteries to discharge any further.

I'm struggling also with the same decision. I like the Prius better but I'm going to choose the HCH solely due to the price differential.

This may seem strange, but in Canada the HCH is priced at $25,800 CDN vs. the Prius which starts at $31,280 CDN (no package). I have a hard time swallowing a difference of $5,480.

Further to my previous note. There are additional options added to the base car for the Canadian marketplace (i.e. heated mirrors, rear window defroster, etc.).
An easy way to compare US vs. Canadian prices and packages is to go to msn.ca and msn.com.
Still, and extra $6k for the Canadian model of the Prius seems too much. A lot of other products are also priced a lot higher in Canada for no apparent reason. I have never seen imported items priced lower in Canada than the US.

I'm 6'1" and my wife is 5'4". When we drive each others' 2003 and 2004 HCHs we have to adjust the seats - but we each fit in them quite well.

I went with the 06 HCH for a number of reason, first being that I got fed up feeding my truck almost $8000/year in repair bills and needed a car right away. I was able to get the HCH two days after visiting my dealer while the Prius was backorderd for months (really lucked out on the HCH as I talked with some other sales people and I somehow lucked out with the second one the dealer had gotten).

I test drove the Prius earlier last year and was thrilled with everything except the acceleration getting on the freeway. The HCH gave me more pickup with the IMA Hybrid engine so I'm happy with that.

My only gripe (and a minor one) with the HCH so far is no bluetooth. I would love to be able to integrate my Treo with the car like I would've been able to do with the Prius. I'm sure Honda will eventually add this to the HCH's later on. The plan w/ the HCH is to keep this until the 09 Prius's come out in 08 and then re-evaluate since the Prius will be getting a makeover.

My recommendation is to test drive each. If you have a friend that has one or the other, see if you can take it for a spin around the block and onto a freeway. I'm pretty sure you'll be happy with whichever you choose.

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