Phoenix Motorcars Electric Sport Utility Truck
Sponsored links:
Phoenix Motorcars, based in Rancho Cucamonga, Calif., had big plans to shake up the EV world, but fell short and finally sputtered into Chapter 11 in April 2009. Its fate is undetermined but the prospects are not high. The company had planned to use engine-less vehicles supplied by Ssangyong, Korea’s fourth largest automaker as the basis for its electric vehicle line in the US. (Ssangyong doesn’t sell cars in the United States). Analysts questioned Phoenix's business model for years and its capacity to deliver a $45,000 electric SUT in any quantities. It now appears that the few models that were produced will become collector's items.
Phoenix was working with UQM Technologies, which has 25 years of experience in building high-performance motors, generators, and controllers. The rechargeable batteries were supplied by Altair Nanotechnology, and the vehicle integration was to be completed by Boshart Engineering. The Boshsart relationship ran into legal problems.
The rise of Phoenix—its promotion in the media and at industry events where it promised 6,000 units for the consumer market in 2008—provide further evidence of the difficulties faced by start-up companies trying to bring an all-electric vehicle to market.
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n/a MPG n/a L/100km
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BODY TYPE:
Pickup
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TECHNOLOGY:
Electric
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BASE MSRP:
$45,000
not bad idea, you'd have to run new lines to the garage for the charging system. This looks like a truck I could use for both business (real estate) and personal use.
I agree, it's a good concept vehicle and is a great way to tell Detroit "if you won't do it, then we will".
What I don't get is the presence of the word "practical" and the price of $45,000 in the same sentence. So either the truck is practical, or is it $45,000, for it can't be both.
A price premium of between 100 and 200 percent is the only thing impractical about any EV in production right now.
I'm as great or greater a proponent of EVs than anyonw. But when you call this $45,000 truck "practical" you signal to the average consumer that this is what you can expect EVs to cost. It suggests that we don't think we have any more work to do before we expect people to start buying these things, and that's not only wrong, it is not helpful to the "cause", so to speak.
Yeah, these folks have come up with an innovative and intriguing electric pick-up truck. And I'd bet money that some day it will be practical as well. But at $45,000, it is absolutely not practical (unless it can fly, or is amphibious, or has some other capabilities you won't find in a $15,000 truck).
Considering that you can buy some fancy, regular pick-up trucks and SUVs for close to that price, I don't think $45,000 is too far out of line.
Practicality refers to how the vehicle can be used. This truck can be loaded up with gear and still perform. Whether it costs $10,000 or $100,000, it's still useful (i.e. practical).
Cost effectiveness is a totally different argument.
While 45,000 for a pick-up is out of my range, others who are capable AND who want to make a statement or to endorse the technology can buy this truck. I agree that this could be the beginning (along with my favorite concept car, the Volt) of a trend for the future.
Fit a engine, reduce the range from 130 mile to 10 miles, sell it for $20K and it will sell well.
Even at 10 miles / day and driven 300 days / year, we can drive 3,000 miles on all electric range in a year.
Plugin Hybrid is way to go.
I don't understand why Toyota has not come out with a mid size hybrid truck (Tacoma). I don't need a truck for huge hauling, just every other Saturday household projects. 16/20 mpg sheeezzz.
Any chance this vehicle could be charged by an appropriate solar electric array?
Well, I'm so glad it's practical, somewhat affordable, and more readily available. I just wish it was all American. With our economy the way it is, we need people to be spending their big bucks on American made items.
American manufacturers seem to have great ideas, but cost way to much and/or won't be available for years yet.
Come on Detroit!
I want one. I am a pickup truck guy with econo fuel wants. I would love to be on the customer list to purchas this truck. Please contact me ! ! ! !
Where is the electric pick up, with a tiny multi fuel or all alcohol generator. Forgoing a bit of lead battery weight and extending the range past a plug in charge. A combustion generator may very well be cheaper than a huge battery array. Getting the market closer to a 15,000 dollar truck. Would it work? This is the way trains work without a plug, submarines into the 1960s worked this way as well.
I would love to own one of these. It is too bad that they are only available for fleet owners and not for sale in Canada. My average truck costs approximately $120.00+ to fill up both tanks. Here in British Columbia it will up to $1.40-$1.50 a litre by the summer time. For those that are interested there are 3.78 litres per 1 imperial gallon. It will end up being $5.29-$5.67 per galllon. I have two gas tanks that have a combined total of 105 litres, it will cost me $147.00-$157.50 to fill the tank. Which last about five days of driving. My average fuel cost will be $882.00-$945.00 a month by this summer. The cost would never reach that with electricity. Not only that I can set up it up with my hydro company to pay a fixed rate per month. The cost would be even cheaper if it were possible to recharge the batteries with solar panels or wind turbines. I really like Addison's comment of having extra batteries so that a person would not be hampered by the milage limitation. The only negative that I might have is that when load up my truck it is never under 1,500 pounds. The box on the truck also looked only six feet long. It will rule out a large portion of working people that need an eight foot box. Mind you I could be wrong about the length of the box. The photo doesn't do the truck justice. As for the cost of the truck, here in Canada trucks cost between $25,000.00-75,000.00. $45,000.00 is not bad.
can anybody help me to make this concept an pratical.
Self power generator
This concept is about generating electric power continuously without using any source of fuel, hydropower, thermal power, or nuclear reactor, this system consist of few know machinery which are assembled together, which are inter dependent to each other so that once the system is ON there is continuously generation of electric power take place.
hi iam from ont. canada and would love to know about your ELECTRIC HAFTTON I THINK ITS THE BEST THING I HAVE READ IN A LONG TIME hope to hear from you soon andy
3.78 litres per US gallon.
4.55 litres per Imperial gallon.
Just thought that may affect your calculations.
put a 4 cyl gas engine in it. just in case you're somewhere without a place to plug it in.
regarding the two battery idea. you realize that a normal car battery wieghs about 40 pounds, and that the batter cells for an all electric vehicle would be at least 20 times (conservatively) as large. thus your "swappable" battery would be 800 pounds!!! that's not something I intend to move around and swap out.
and what the heck is the guy talking about with a "self powered generator" that's like saying perpetual motion. dream on it's impossible.
I'm on the list for this vehicle. It will not replace my F-350 or my wife's Tahoe completely. But for all the local driving @ 0.08 cents per KWH that we pay for electricity, this vehicle would cost just under one penney per mile to opperate. (According to their website the car goes 3.78 miles per KWH.) If I only drove this vehicle & not the other two, I would save over 8 thousand dollars in fuel costs PER YEAR!
My only hope is that their technology is good & this isn't full of wishfull thinking.
We'll see..........
With as of today via CNBC, oil prices have been quoted to rise between $150-$200 a barrel. That means prices at the pump, in the U.S. doubling from $3.60-$3.80 a gal. to well over $7.00 a Gal.
WE HAVE TO GET OFF THE ADDICTION FOR THIS OIL "NOW." Hats off to those innovative, visionaries willing and able to take on the auto industory, the FAT oil companies willing to invision, develope, with new concepts, thinking "outside the box" and bring to market, products such as this truck.
It's rather pricie but, what's our alternative....
The Phoenix battery is made by Altair Nanotechnology. Here is an except from Forbes magazine. You can read the entire article at
http://www.forbes.com/2008/01/12/electric-cars-nanotech-tech-sciences-cz...
Although CEO Gotcher is quoted in the article, but he is no longer with Altair.
Then there's the challenge of where to get the big dose of power to recharge the batteries.
Phoenix recharges its electric truck battery in 10 minutes with a 440-volt charger--four times the amount of energy in a home wall socket. Scaling that operation, however, would be a challenge: Existing electric grids couldn't easily handle the power drain of rapidly recharging millions of such electric batteries.
So in early January Altair also built its first pair of industrial 1-megawatt batteries--each about the size of a freight car--designed to store excess electricity produced at night. The Virginia power utility AES (nyse: AES - news - people ) plans to use the mega-batteries to warehouse power for use during peak consumption times.
Such batteries could help Altair offer 10-minute recharges to the masses. Futuristic filling stations might feature massive batteries below ground, replacing the gasoline storage tanks of today.
Without such infrastructure, going green will certainly take more time. “Five-hour charges would be the fastest possible for residential drivers,” admits Bryon Bliss of Phoenix Motorcars.
phoenix motorcar 100% electric trucks. your truck gets 130 miles to a charge what if you could get 300 miles and more. there is a unit that will power your 220 volt charger on board with out stopping to plug in. this unit dose not run on any oil products,solor products and not on regenerative braking system.and you don't have to be moving for it to work. interrested in endless miles. you have my e-mial.baroness
I have now read a few articles on the truck and the SUV. Detroit, Euro, and Japan need to get their rears in gear and mass produce similar vehicles!! Put one of these at my local dealership and I will buy it in a heartbeat, and many others will as well !!
When and where I can get this truck? Please let me reply.
So what if it takes a few hours to charge? People don't need to recharge in 10 minutes unless it's some kind of emergency or poor planning. Most cars spend their time parked, only to be used for perhaps an hour or two a day. thats 22 hours of potential charging time. If you can only charge at home, it should get at least 10 hours of charging time. At 3KW (220V@30A) that should be enough to fully charge a depleted battery (assuming 30kwh capacity, which is common for an EV). That's about 4 dollars for a deep charge. In practice people will not deplete a battery during a round trip commute. Besides, a frequently topped off battery will last longer, as deep discharges shorten life.
I'm shure that someone has already answered your question. However, I don't like to assume so in answer to your question yes. and this is the best answer to the gas problem because you would eleminat the need for gas from the gastank and from the utility companies as well.
solar and wind are the way to go, good call
This vehicle looks promising and for the average driver it is probabley just right.
I on the other hand would need somthing with a longer range (300+ milles a day) since my job carries me between cittys.
It costs me over $1200.00 a month just in gas.
I would love to see this vehicle with a 500km range and be able to charge it with 120V in less than an hour. Wonder if that will ever be possible........
To answer the question of guy with the self powered generator.
All you have to do is create a device that can output 5 times it's energy in input!
It's just that easy.
This EV is a good step forward. $45,000 is steep for us hourly working people. I feel the EV must sticker under $39,999 to really get noticed by the masses. Just when a person is ready to buy, the idea of getting by with a Yaris, Fit, Cruze, or other micro car costing under $16,000, gets in the way.
I also feel that 900 pounds of battery weight seems a bit much to turtle shell around. A 500 pound battery, 200 mile range, and lower out-the-door price will create a big winner and huge volume. Thank you Phoenix for a strong step forward in EV technology.
The batteries weigh over a thousand pounds and make up a very large chunk of that 45K price tag. Besides, the batteries can charge in 10 min if you have enough juice.
About the cost:
You've gotta remember that the power-train maintenance costs WILL be lower than for an internal combustion engine; No oil, air & oil filters, tune-ups, radiator hoses, radiators, catalytic converters, oil leaks etc.
As an aside; scooter dealers don't generally sell electric scooters because they make much of their income on service...otherwise known as breakdowns, tune-ups, carb jobs.
Take the $7,500 Fed credit and it drops price to $37,500; add some state $$ and could get lowered some more.
All indications are that Lithium batteries(LiFePo at least) are indeed capable of long-life(10 years or longer) with proper battery management(very, very important). Not sure about Lithium Titanate?
Solar or wind charging is just a matter of integration into your home electrical system, and the vehicle becomes just another load; so no problems there, except cost.
I'm glad they've chosen a Korean base.
I am all for EV's, however, there are serious down sides to them too, the main one is not driving distance is environmental. The number of batteries that those cars would be discarded could gianormous unless organic, biodegradable and compostable, 100% recyclable and/or reusable materials are used in future automobile batteries.
Green automobiles should be build completely recyclable. we have the technology and the will as individuals to support an environmentally sound society, the US car industry should spearhead the industrial renaissance of the 21th century, green, reliable, and 100% recyclable. How about if we were paid a handsome sum recycling, our motor vehicles will retain a higher value as is the case of buying silver, platinum, copper, plastics, paper products, wood, aluminum, etc.
Think of it as investing in your retirement portfolio a chunk of raw materials, as they continue to be used the value should continue to climb.
Many of us still remember when Toyota, Ford, and GM were producing EV's in California,
A modified GM EV1 prototype set a land speed record for production electric vehicles of 183 mph (295 km/h) in 1994. and 75 to 150 miles (120 to 240 km) per charge with Gen 2 Ovonic nickel-metal hydride batteries. Recharging took as much as eight hours for a full charge (although one could get an 80% charge in two to three hours).
General Motors used many advanced technologies in developing the EV1. These included:
* Aluminum frame
* Dent resistant side panels
* Anti-lock brakes
* Traction control
* Heat pump (Heater/AC)
* Keyless entry and keyless ignition
* Special one-way thermal glass to allow for better heat rejection
* Regenerative braking
* Very low drag coefficient - Cd~0.19, CdA~0.36 m² (3.95 ft²)
* Super light magnesium alloy wheels
* Self-sealing & low rolling resistance tires (developed by Michelin)
* Automated tire pressure loss warning system
* Magnesium framed seats
* Time programmable HVAC (cabin heating or cooling) settings
Most of these technologies were included to improve the overall efficiency of the EV1.
OK, so what are we supposed to do with these vehicles once they have outlived the battrery life??? Those batteries are gonna be expencive. Very likely well over half the cost of a new vehicle. In 10 years are we expected to just walk away from it and buy another vehicle? What about trade in value on a vehicle with dead batteries? Nobody is going to give you anything for a 8-10 year old electric vehicle if their going to have to put over $20,000 dollars worth of batteries in it. Until they figure out a more cost efficient battery pack, forget it. Your only option now is to trade it in every few years. There again you have to consider depreciation. $45K less 4-5 years of use = at least 1/2 of the cost or $20-25,000 in depreciation. Still dont know anybody who's going to give you $20-25K for your 5 year old vehicle knowing the batteries only have a few years of life left. Keep in mind that battery life is dependent on how it was cared for. I've see new batteries go dead in less that a couple of year without proper charging methods/habbits.
You'll never get your money back out of one of these vehicles. You need to wait till the prices come down.
Good luck guys. Your fixing to take a beating.
I had hopes that someone would come along and rescue the company from bankruptcy but that didn't happen as far as I can tell. I was looking forward to these vehicles being in dealerships by now and am disappointed that it didn't happen.
Companies like Phoenix, Tesla, Aptera and so many others sprang up because the Big 3 would not make EVs and GM even killed their Saturn EV. They could have brought out an electric vehicle years ago if they'd continued research and development.
Hopefully the Aptera will eventually make it to market and be a great seller.
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